[quote=""Ken, Steelheads fan""]I'm a bit stubborn when it comes to the USBL Patroons. No argument can convince me that the Patroons were justified in NOT traveling to the end of season tournament. The USBL league office was in shambles, sure I agree. However, the remaining teams only had themselves to depend on during the latter part of the 2007 season. It was the tournament host, Oklahoma Storm, the Patroons hurt by choosing not to travel. The USBL, the league, was a non-factor. All the remaining USBL teams participated in the tournament. The Patroons reneged on their travel obligations.[/quote]
That may be, but I don't know exactly what transpired with the USBL. Seemed like the Patroons knew it was a lost cause and threw in the towel early, but this is a different situation. The facts here look pretty indisputable. Tuckman tries to blame Albany, but a day later he folds the Explorers for the year. Not Albany's fault.
Down to Nine?
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I think it is pretty clear that the Patroons did not go to GF because there was no reasonable expectation that a venue would be found and that proved to be true. There is no reason to spend money, cash strapped or not to find that out. I think that is about as clear as it can be.
If the Patroons are cash strapped (which I don't believe), the USBL had a lot to do with it. Joining that league was a tremendous mistake for the organization, it hurt the credibility and quality of the Patroon "brand", was a reschedule after reschedule joke, local high school refs were used, many cancellations and folds. It appeared to be more an effort by management to "fill dates" in the armory (that the organization owns) than it was an effort to protect the quality of Patroon Basketball. A perhaps well intended but miserable failure. The Patroons decided not to participate in the playoffs because the credibility and integrity of the season and USBL has long since been lost. Also pretty clear truth. They forfeited no regular season games.
The CBA patroons today are fully staffed (10 players on bench at last home game) with an xNBA head coach since day 1, an assistant and a professional announcer that also does the ALBANY D1 games. While there are obvious other bills to pay and I am sure they are not rolling in the $ like any CBA team today, typically a fully staffed team this late in the season is (a green flag) and not a symptom of a cash strapped team.
If the Patroons are cash strapped (which I don't believe), the USBL had a lot to do with it. Joining that league was a tremendous mistake for the organization, it hurt the credibility and quality of the Patroon "brand", was a reschedule after reschedule joke, local high school refs were used, many cancellations and folds. It appeared to be more an effort by management to "fill dates" in the armory (that the organization owns) than it was an effort to protect the quality of Patroon Basketball. A perhaps well intended but miserable failure. The Patroons decided not to participate in the playoffs because the credibility and integrity of the season and USBL has long since been lost. Also pretty clear truth. They forfeited no regular season games.
The CBA patroons today are fully staffed (10 players on bench at last home game) with an xNBA head coach since day 1, an assistant and a professional announcer that also does the ALBANY D1 games. While there are obvious other bills to pay and I am sure they are not rolling in the $ like any CBA team today, typically a fully staffed team this late in the season is (a green flag) and not a symptom of a cash strapped team.
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Chuck the Writer
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[quote=""Patroons1""]The CBA patroons today are fully staffed (10 players on bench at last home game) with an xNBA head coach since day 1, an assistant and a professional announcer that also does the ALBANY D1 games. [/quote]
And when that announcer's not available because of UAlbany commitments, then I step in, as his backup, and take the microphone. I'll be doing that at the Patroons' next home game against Minot.
And another thing about the USBL. The Patroons not only played all their home games, they went to all their road contests when the teams were available, even the rescheduled games. The USBL tournament was three weeks after the Pats' last home game, and by then the playoff format had been twisted around several different times. Even if the Patroons themselves did not go to the tourney, several of their players did participate in the tournament as members of other teams (I believe Eric Williams was on the Gary squad, for example).
And when that announcer's not available because of UAlbany commitments, then I step in, as his backup, and take the microphone. I'll be doing that at the Patroons' next home game against Minot.
And another thing about the USBL. The Patroons not only played all their home games, they went to all their road contests when the teams were available, even the rescheduled games. The USBL tournament was three weeks after the Pats' last home game, and by then the playoff format had been twisted around several different times. Even if the Patroons themselves did not go to the tourney, several of their players did participate in the tournament as members of other teams (I believe Eric Williams was on the Gary squad, for example).
Moving... Are you kidding?
[quote=""Shootmaster_44""]I find it strange that Great Falls didn't move to another city. If it was simply a case of venue problems, there are likely other cities that could host a team for the remaining part of the season. Not counting the games that were supposed to be played last night and tonight, the Explorers have 4 home games left. They couldn't find a venue for four measly dates? They could've moved the team across the border to Lethbridge or a little further East here to Saskatoon and saved the team.
[/quote]
Obviously you haven't been following the "Shenanigans of the Infamous Mr. Tuckman"... moving the team wouldn't make a difference as long as he was still at the helm.
The man's a conman who refuses to pay any of his bills and would have the same issues no matter where he went.
Also, he wouldn't be able to go anywhere because word has spread and no one would deal with him unless he paid cash up front for the venue (hotel rooms, travel, etc.).
As I said once before "SHADY, SHADY, SHADY."
[/quote]
Obviously you haven't been following the "Shenanigans of the Infamous Mr. Tuckman"... moving the team wouldn't make a difference as long as he was still at the helm.
The man's a conman who refuses to pay any of his bills and would have the same issues no matter where he went.
Also, he wouldn't be able to go anywhere because word has spread and no one would deal with him unless he paid cash up front for the venue (hotel rooms, travel, etc.).
As I said once before "SHADY, SHADY, SHADY."
No room at the Inn
[quote=""Kev the Cav""]If Albany DID travel to Great Falls, would they have had a place to stay?
I'm pretty sure I read the home team pays for the visitor's rooms and the Explorers themselves had just been evicted, so I wonder if either team had a place to stay in Great Falls.[/quote]
Nope, Kev, if they'd travelled here, they wouldn't have had a place to stay unless they footed the bill themselves (normally covered by the home team). All of the hotels in Great Falls have blacklisted Tuckman and won't book anything that's billed to him because they know they'll never see the money.
Seriously, there has to be some kind of law that he's broken here (if he were an individual writing bad checks it would be)... with the amount of money he's scr##ed local businesses out of it should be a felony!
I'm pretty sure I read the home team pays for the visitor's rooms and the Explorers themselves had just been evicted, so I wonder if either team had a place to stay in Great Falls.[/quote]
Nope, Kev, if they'd travelled here, they wouldn't have had a place to stay unless they footed the bill themselves (normally covered by the home team). All of the hotels in Great Falls have blacklisted Tuckman and won't book anything that's billed to him because they know they'll never see the money.
Seriously, there has to be some kind of law that he's broken here (if he were an individual writing bad checks it would be)... with the amount of money he's scr##ed local businesses out of it should be a felony!
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Ken, Steelheads fan
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[quote=""Patroons1""]I think it is pretty clear that the Patroons did not go to GF because there was no reasonable expectation that a venue would be found and that proved to be true. There is no reason to spend money, cash strapped or not to find that out. I think that is about as clear as it can be.
If the Patroons are cash strapped (which I don't believe), the USBL had a lot to do with it. Joining that league was a tremendous mistake for the organization, it hurt the credibility and quality of the Patroon "brand", was a reschedule after reschedule joke, local high school refs were used, many cancellations and folds. It appeared to be more an effort by management to "fill dates" in the armory (that the organization owns) than it was an effort to protect the quality of Patroon Basketball. A perhaps well intended but miserable failure. The Patroons decided not to participate in the playoffs because the credibility and integrity of the season and USBL has long since been lost. Also pretty clear truth. They forfeited no regular season games.
The CBA patroons today are fully staffed (10 players on bench at last home game) with an xNBA head coach since day 1, an assistant and a professional announcer that also does the ALBANY D1 games. While there are obvious other bills to pay and I am sure they are not rolling in the $ like any CBA team today, typically a fully staffed team this late in the season is (a green flag) and not a symptom of a cash strapped team.[/quote]
Hmmmmm. You also didn't believe that the Explorers' organization was stealing services in Great Falls when I pointed that out to you a few months back. Putting people up in hotels with no intentions of paying the bill is exactly that. They might as well have been shoplifting from the local Wal*Mart.
Only time will tell on the Patroons organization. You see a green flag and I see a red flag.
If the Patroons are cash strapped (which I don't believe), the USBL had a lot to do with it. Joining that league was a tremendous mistake for the organization, it hurt the credibility and quality of the Patroon "brand", was a reschedule after reschedule joke, local high school refs were used, many cancellations and folds. It appeared to be more an effort by management to "fill dates" in the armory (that the organization owns) than it was an effort to protect the quality of Patroon Basketball. A perhaps well intended but miserable failure. The Patroons decided not to participate in the playoffs because the credibility and integrity of the season and USBL has long since been lost. Also pretty clear truth. They forfeited no regular season games.
The CBA patroons today are fully staffed (10 players on bench at last home game) with an xNBA head coach since day 1, an assistant and a professional announcer that also does the ALBANY D1 games. While there are obvious other bills to pay and I am sure they are not rolling in the $ like any CBA team today, typically a fully staffed team this late in the season is (a green flag) and not a symptom of a cash strapped team.[/quote]
Hmmmmm. You also didn't believe that the Explorers' organization was stealing services in Great Falls when I pointed that out to you a few months back. Putting people up in hotels with no intentions of paying the bill is exactly that. They might as well have been shoplifting from the local Wal*Mart.
Only time will tell on the Patroons organization. You see a green flag and I see a red flag.
I will weigh in on this topic. There is no way Albany should have even considered traveling to GF. Albany had a poor season on the court and at the gate this year, and I am sure are losing a few $$$ this year. They wont make the Playoffs (2 per division, trust me) and will finish the season with a decent product.
I see no flag, not on this point. The USBL is in the past, and the Patroons may just have recognized that before most others.
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A .500 season isn't poor..
..I'll be the first to say that this year's season didn't meet expectations in Albany, but a .500 season isn't poor or awful, it's average. RGV and Atlanta had poor seasons, not Albany.
I think the Pats will be back next season, but with Jim Coyne back at the helm instead of current management. I actually saw a Patroons TV ad for the series with Minot this weekend. Amazing.
Ticket prices were higher this season (with the gimmick of a free 12 and under with every paid adult, which I don't think worked well), so the b/e was probably a bit lower. Jim Coyne said at the end of last season that the Pats broke even.
I think the Pats will be back next season, but with Jim Coyne back at the helm instead of current management. I actually saw a Patroons TV ad for the series with Minot this weekend. Amazing.
Ticket prices were higher this season (with the gimmick of a free 12 and under with every paid adult, which I don't think worked well), so the b/e was probably a bit lower. Jim Coyne said at the end of last season that the Pats broke even.
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PikevilleOT
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[quote=""SUNKINGS""]I will weigh in on this topic. There is no way Albany should have even considered traveling to GF. Albany had a poor season on the court and at the gate this year, and I am sure are losing a few $$$ this year. They wont make the Playoffs (2 per division, trust me) and will finish the season with a decent product.[/quote]
trust vs. distrust....I have no reason to doubt your word. However, I am positive we heard top 3. what is your source for top 2?
thanks.
trust vs. distrust....I have no reason to doubt your word. However, I am positive we heard top 3. what is your source for top 2?
thanks.
