New League - More Details
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VinnyTheViper
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The PIFL message board is now up and running!
Last edited by VinnyTheViper on Wed Sep 14, 2011 10:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.
[quote=""VinnyTheViper""]Nor did I say anywhere that the AFL and the af2 were perfect, every league has its problems, I was simply combating the charge that a "vote per team" philosophy would not work or that it was not practical, pointing out that there is a 34 year record out there that says that the philosophy is at least functional. I would suggest that this type of philosophy will produce far better results than allowing leagues to be run by dictators.
And to answer another post in this thread, no where did I say that every issue has to be decided by a league's Board of Directors, OBVIOUSLY there are issues that the commissioner is charged to deal with that never rise to the BOD voting level. But the issues that rise to the BOD level should be voted on by every team, if the league is run properly, there should not be that many times in a given season that would require votes, most of the votes would be likely cast in the off-season at the owner's or league meetings before the next season starts.
Finally, I consider the AFL and the af2 to also be ABC leagues, comprised of at least three letters or characters, notice, I said "other" ABC leagues, that implies that inclusion of the AFL and the af2 in the same mix as the IFL, SIFL, UIFL, and AIFA.[/quote]
Excuse me, but you were bragging about the AFL lasting a combined 34 years, implying that it was better than the other indoor leagues for lasting longer combined, and that's what I was responding to and in fact quoted. The AFL may look slicker because more money is being spent, but it's no different and is losing money hand over fist just like the indoor leagues. To say every indoor league is the same isn't true as well. Each IFL team owner gets a vote in everything as well. The UIF and Intense leagues were the same. The IFL also have an executive committee that takes care of other issues, so to say all the other ABC leagues are the same is untrue. If you do agree that the AFL/AF2 are also to be lumped in with the other ABC leagues, then we are on the same page after all.
And to answer another post in this thread, no where did I say that every issue has to be decided by a league's Board of Directors, OBVIOUSLY there are issues that the commissioner is charged to deal with that never rise to the BOD voting level. But the issues that rise to the BOD level should be voted on by every team, if the league is run properly, there should not be that many times in a given season that would require votes, most of the votes would be likely cast in the off-season at the owner's or league meetings before the next season starts.
Finally, I consider the AFL and the af2 to also be ABC leagues, comprised of at least three letters or characters, notice, I said "other" ABC leagues, that implies that inclusion of the AFL and the af2 in the same mix as the IFL, SIFL, UIFL, and AIFA.[/quote]
Excuse me, but you were bragging about the AFL lasting a combined 34 years, implying that it was better than the other indoor leagues for lasting longer combined, and that's what I was responding to and in fact quoted. The AFL may look slicker because more money is being spent, but it's no different and is losing money hand over fist just like the indoor leagues. To say every indoor league is the same isn't true as well. Each IFL team owner gets a vote in everything as well. The UIF and Intense leagues were the same. The IFL also have an executive committee that takes care of other issues, so to say all the other ABC leagues are the same is untrue. If you do agree that the AFL/AF2 are also to be lumped in with the other ABC leagues, then we are on the same page after all.
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Trish_lvs_Baltimore
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- Location: Baltimore, Md.
lol!!!!-
coachingubigr
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Trish_lvs_Baltimore
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- Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2010 3:04 pm
- Location: Baltimore, Md.
[quote=""coachingubigr""]you know him?[/quote]No, never heard of him. By why do you call him a JERK???.....lol. Why go off and insult someone you don't know personally? If you were living with him on a daily basis, then you could make the determination of him being a "douche" or not..
Last edited by Trish_lvs_Baltimore on Thu Sep 15, 2011 1:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The First and Always The Finest
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jerry101jlh
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IndoorExpert
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- Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 6:48 am
[quote=""jerry101jlh""]I can argue with anything you say or at least for the most part. I do think that the constant hashing of problems has brought some progress, although not as much as is needed. I tend to disagree that the average fan sees no difference or could care less about the league affiliation. I believe that may be true if teams stick with the same league and the on field competition doesn't change from year to year. Rivalries are made through facing those same teams each year and not new ones every season. I'm not sure that in the case of this new PIFL that sponsorship and attendance might not both increase. Maybe not in the first season, but in following ones if they do things right.[/quote]
What progress has been made? Please be specific. Why will the PIFL or LSFL generate more fans? How will it generate more sponsors? The economy is in shambles and this product is no longer viable. When indoor football was popular and the long list of dirty laundry wasnt all over the internet, the UIF tried it with a good initial business plan. I thought they had the best chance. They found it no more profitable. So please tell us all in great detail what the difference will be with another alphabet league.
I did not say that the average fan sees no difference or that people could care less about league affiliation. On the contrary. If my local team let's say goes from the NIFL to the UIF, I see a slight change (rules). If it then goes to the SIFL, I again see a drastic change in the rules. Now if my team then again goes to the LSFL, I probably will see the exact same AFL rules. However, if I bought my children shirts that say NIFL, and then it changes 4 more times to different leagues but I keep seeing the same teams, I am no longer a true fan. I see the product as not viable and I find several ways to get free tickets or dont go to the game. I see this in many indoor football cities. The tickets become devalued. So I am against the same teams jumping from league to league. In my opinion, that is not a viable product and not very professional. I would rather see a college or NFL game even if the money is much higher. I at least feel I get a professional product without such a bad stigma.
What progress has been made? Please be specific. Why will the PIFL or LSFL generate more fans? How will it generate more sponsors? The economy is in shambles and this product is no longer viable. When indoor football was popular and the long list of dirty laundry wasnt all over the internet, the UIF tried it with a good initial business plan. I thought they had the best chance. They found it no more profitable. So please tell us all in great detail what the difference will be with another alphabet league.
I did not say that the average fan sees no difference or that people could care less about league affiliation. On the contrary. If my local team let's say goes from the NIFL to the UIF, I see a slight change (rules). If it then goes to the SIFL, I again see a drastic change in the rules. Now if my team then again goes to the LSFL, I probably will see the exact same AFL rules. However, if I bought my children shirts that say NIFL, and then it changes 4 more times to different leagues but I keep seeing the same teams, I am no longer a true fan. I see the product as not viable and I find several ways to get free tickets or dont go to the game. I see this in many indoor football cities. The tickets become devalued. So I am against the same teams jumping from league to league. In my opinion, that is not a viable product and not very professional. I would rather see a college or NFL game even if the money is much higher. I at least feel I get a professional product without such a bad stigma.
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jerry101jlh
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[quote=""IndoorExpert""]What progress has been made? Please be specific. Why will the PIFL or LSFL generate more fans? How will it generate more sponsors? The economy is in shambles and this product is no longer viable. When indoor football was popular and the long list of dirty laundry wasnt all over the internet, the UIF tried it with a good initial business plan. I thought they had the best chance. They found it no more profitable. So please tell us all in great detail what the difference will be with another alphabet league.
I did not say that the average fan sees no difference or that people could care less about league affiliation. On the contrary. If my local team let's say goes from the NIFL to the UIF, I see a slight change (rules). If it then goes to the SIFL, I again see a drastic change in the rules. Now if my team then again goes to the LSFL, I probably will see the exact same AFL rules. However, if I bought my children shirts that say NIFL, and then it changes 4 more times to different leagues but I keep seeing the same teams, I am no longer a true fan. I see the product as not viable and I find several ways to get free tickets or don't go to the game. I see this in many indoor football cities. The tickets become devalued. So I am against the same teams jumping from league to league. In my opinion, that is not a viable product and not very professional. I would rather see a college or NFL game even if the money is much higher. I at least feel I get a professional product without such a bad stigma.[/quote]
Stability by being in the same league, playing the same teams over time should generate more fan interest and as that grows so should sponsor interest. I guess the 50+ ownerships in this game completely stupid to invest in a non viable business venture. In essence that is what you said. I never said you said average fan. I believe I said some say.
I did not say that the average fan sees no difference or that people could care less about league affiliation. On the contrary. If my local team let's say goes from the NIFL to the UIF, I see a slight change (rules). If it then goes to the SIFL, I again see a drastic change in the rules. Now if my team then again goes to the LSFL, I probably will see the exact same AFL rules. However, if I bought my children shirts that say NIFL, and then it changes 4 more times to different leagues but I keep seeing the same teams, I am no longer a true fan. I see the product as not viable and I find several ways to get free tickets or don't go to the game. I see this in many indoor football cities. The tickets become devalued. So I am against the same teams jumping from league to league. In my opinion, that is not a viable product and not very professional. I would rather see a college or NFL game even if the money is much higher. I at least feel I get a professional product without such a bad stigma.[/quote]
Stability by being in the same league, playing the same teams over time should generate more fan interest and as that grows so should sponsor interest. I guess the 50+ ownerships in this game completely stupid to invest in a non viable business venture. In essence that is what you said. I never said you said average fan. I believe I said some say.
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IndoorExpert
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And dont get me wrong. I absolutely love indoor football. I have watched the same "We will do it better this time" speech given a thousand times. There is only so many business plans that can work, and they all depend on having deep pockets. Passion by a few does not equate to business sense. People think this is small mans NFL, but those fantasy owners keep folding teams every year.
There is a reason the AFL considers themselves a much higher level. Ownership groups and coaches are just way better in the AFL. Not to say it makes more money, but there is a difference. The AFL just keeps getting TV deals and that is more than I can say for indoor football. Why is there so many head coaches in the indoor game that couldnt even head coach a high school team? Why? Because indoor football is for the most part about saving money these days. Now you hire whoever is local that will take the smallest salary. We have all heard the statement, you get what you pay for. Why do commission only sales staffs do so poorly? The only thing that has gotten better over the years is the player talent.
There is a reason the AFL considers themselves a much higher level. Ownership groups and coaches are just way better in the AFL. Not to say it makes more money, but there is a difference. The AFL just keeps getting TV deals and that is more than I can say for indoor football. Why is there so many head coaches in the indoor game that couldnt even head coach a high school team? Why? Because indoor football is for the most part about saving money these days. Now you hire whoever is local that will take the smallest salary. We have all heard the statement, you get what you pay for. Why do commission only sales staffs do so poorly? The only thing that has gotten better over the years is the player talent.
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IndoorExpert
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[quote=""jerry101jlh""]Stability by being in the same league, playing the same teams over time should generate more fan interest and as that grows so should sponsor interest. I guess the 50+ ownerships in this game completely stupid to invest in a non viable business venture. In essence that is what you said. I never said you said average fan. I believe I said some say.[/quote]
Passion of being part of sports is huge. How many people live their fantasies through sports as a way to get away from reality. These are the same people that own teams. How many teams have made money since the inception of indoor football that did it after paying all bills, players, and coaches? You have been around long enough to know that very few turn a profit. So what do you call a person with small pockets that invests in indoor football? This is why I say it is a game for the persons with deep pockets looking for a hobby.
Passion of being part of sports is huge. How many people live their fantasies through sports as a way to get away from reality. These are the same people that own teams. How many teams have made money since the inception of indoor football that did it after paying all bills, players, and coaches? You have been around long enough to know that very few turn a profit. So what do you call a person with small pockets that invests in indoor football? This is why I say it is a game for the persons with deep pockets looking for a hobby.
