Welcome the Florida Stingray's

The Southern Indoor Football League (SIFL) forum
jimsmith
Site Admin
Posts: 23
Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:07 am

Post by jimsmith » Tue Aug 09, 2011 7:31 pm

Regardless of business model expenses are expenses. Someone has to write the checks and the fans owning the team sounds good in theory like the packers but indoor football isn't the NFL. New CEO is great as long as he brings his check book and doesn't depend on fans donating to a non profit. Also i'm Not sure how many teams in the SIFL are eager to add the additional travel cost down to play in ft myers.

jerry101jlh
Site Admin
Posts: 1474
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 7:37 pm

Post by jerry101jlh » Tue Aug 09, 2011 8:20 pm

[quote=""jimsmith""]Regardless of business model expenses are expenses. Someone has to write the checks and the fans owning the team sounds good in theory like the packers but indoor football isn't the NFL. New CEO is great as long as he brings his check book and doesn't depend on fans donating to a non profit. Also i'm Not sure how many teams in the SIFL are eager to add the additional travel cost down to play in ft myers.[/quote]

The old wait and see. Well we'll wait, no other choice, but what we see most likely not worth the wait. it rarely is worth the wait

newiflfan
Site Admin
Posts: 659
Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2010 4:51 pm

Post by newiflfan » Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:21 pm

[quote=""jerry101jlh""]The old wait and see. Well we'll wait, no other choice, but what we see most likely not worth the wait. it rarely is worth the wait[/quote]

But they got a business plan from the GREEN friggin' BAY PACKERS! How can't that work? :rolleyes:

sportznut
Site Admin
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2006 10:08 pm

Post by sportznut » Thu Aug 11, 2011 2:40 am

Jay, there is no attack on my part on your potential team.

Just leery, Last season the team from Rome Georgia announced their entrance into the SIFL and everything was a go, and then a week or 2 later, the SIFL stated there was no team in Rome Ga. So from my angle, the post asking why there was no SIFL involvement in the release.... bears merit...

In the 2 seasons i was Dir of Ops with the SIFL, we stressed to the teams, let the League make the first announcement on matters concerning the league. I get your excitement and wanting to launch ASAP. I would advise on theside of caution when it comes to the league.
Changes.... they are a coming......

jerry101jlh
Site Admin
Posts: 1474
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 7:37 pm

Post by jerry101jlh » Thu Aug 11, 2011 8:23 am

[quote=""sportznut""]Jay, there is no attack on my part on your potential team.

Just leery, Last season the team from Rome Georgia announced their entrance into the SIFL and everything was a go, and then a week or 2 later, the SIFL stated there was no team in Rome Ga. So from my angle, the post asking why there was no SIFL involvement in the release.... bears merit...

In the 2 seasons i was Dir of Ops with the SIFL, we stressed to the teams, let the League make the first announcement on matters concerning the league. I get your excitement and wanting to launch ASAP. I would advise on theside of caution when it comes to the league.[/quote]

but nut if they waited for the league to announce first they'd never get announced lol

JayLawrence
Site Admin
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2011 7:52 pm

Post by JayLawrence » Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:24 am

To make this EXTREMELY CLEAR...............

WE ONLY SIGNED A LOI WITH THE SIFL!

Look, did I ever say, "I have the money, myself, to do this!" NO! But, you can't say my team and I aren't working our butts off to make it happen or that our motives are selfish. We know WHEN this happens, we will have accomplished a lot. How about, if you people ARE real fans and care about Indoor/arena football, you embrace us and try to help us rather than drag us down. Wouldn't you like to have all pro sports teams sell the team to the people who live in their community?

Comet
Site Admin
Posts: 29
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 11:32 am

Post by Comet » Thu Aug 11, 2011 12:15 pm

Jay, I don't think there are a lot of issues with the Florida Stingrays as much as there are with the SIFL.

Just consider, this is a league that accepted a LOI when, as you just admitted, POF aren't exactly following immediately. The league seems desperate in this regard. However, I can understand where your group might be coming from.

Just curious, was your decision to announce the LOI an effort to be attractive to prospective ownership groups that could financially float the team?

I understand it's sometimes easier to get people behind you when what you have is real.

Good luck to you. Hopefully your influence will only make for a better league. If not, you can always jump ship to the IFL in a couple of years.

Caballo Diablo
Site Admin
Posts: 2159
Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2008 10:43 pm

Post by Caballo Diablo » Thu Aug 11, 2011 1:44 pm

[quote=""JayLawrence""] How about, if you people ARE real fans and care about Indoor/arena football, you embrace us and try to help us rather than drag us down. [/quote]Jay, no one is trying to drag you or your potential team down. As comet says, most of the skepticism and negativity are directed at the SIFL, not you. Much of the same comments would be here for any team under these circumstances.

I am curious though, how long have you been an Indoor Football fan? Have you closely followed the sport? Have you closely watched the SIFL over it's three year history? Were you even aware of the SIFL in their first two years? Have you ever heard of or know about the issues surrounding the Florida Kings and the SIFL? Did you know the SIFL played an entire season without insurance and hid it from the teams? There's probably a lot you don't know about the SIFL.

The first two seasons were full of problems encountered by many start-up business endeavors and excused as such. The third season, last season was a total joke. The SIFL dropped lower than a poorly run start-up. It was supposed to be auditioning their services to the AFL for a buy out. A new commissioner was announced, but you would be hard pressed to say he actually filled the position. Season three made the first two seasons look good.

They couldn't even correctly update the league website. They listed a team in the standings all season on their site that wasn't even in the league and never played a game. Many games were played with semi-pro and even pick up teams lower than semi-pro. The league wouldn't address issues or even publically pretend they cared. This alone should scare you. Even if you are successful and field a team, will you be able to handle the huge travel schedule? How many teams will not bother to show up in Florida for your home games? Can you secure enough local players to field an opponent for your team on short notice? Have you got a spare set of uniforms for them to wear? Yes, we know, they want an all Florida Division. This was their goal from day one. Once again, wishful thinking is nice but should be a bonus, not what you need to produce the bare minium. How many expansion teams in the division will actually make it through the entire season?

None of this is being sarcastic or a backhanded slap at you or your potential franchise. This is how the league has always operated, and was at it's worst last season. These are real issues you need to plan for. A good league can help start-up franchise through the difficult first couple of seasons, the history of the SIFL is the start-ups are on their own and sometimes even a whipping boy for the SIFL. They either quickly die on the vine or say screw the SIFL and either fold or move to another league.

I'm also curious about you statement of being "Real Fans." When did you first learn about these message boards? Are they new to you? Have you been a longtime reader? Possibly a poster under a different username? A sizable percentage of the posters here are more than your typical fan. They have either worked in team or league front offices. We've even had players, owners, and investors post here. Heck, there's still a current SIFL Director posting here on a regular basis, albeit he'll tell you there's more important things to life than a part time gig in a silly Indoor League.

Not only are we real fans, we're Longtime fans well aware of the history of the sport and the SIFL. We understand an LOI is meaningless, especially in this league. Heck, they can approve and announce you and it still be meaningless as to whether you actually field a team or play out your schedule. In most cases it would be wise for no announcement from the league about an LOI as it doesn't mean anything besides someone is interested. The problem is we aren't convinced the league is doing it's due diligence in the background of silence, we expect it's just the same old same old ignoring their duties as usual.


[quote=""JayLawrence""]Wouldn't you like to have all pro sports teams sell the team to the people who live in their community?[/quote]
No, it's not financially viable. The packer success isn't what you should equate to. The NFL is unlike any other sport/league, they were just fighting over how to share $9 Billion and they are aware a fan owned team isn't the way to do business and it was disallowed, the Packers were grandfathered. "Fan" ownership isn't anything more than you owning some stock in a mutual fund. The "Fans" aren't putting in any money when needed like "Real" team owners, they're just sitting in their easy chair staring at the framed stock certificate hanging on the den wall.

The 50 yard sport is NOT a wise investment. It's a niche, very small niche sport for hobbyist willing to lose money. The average fan is clueless as to the goings on in the business side of the sport, they just show up in small numbers on game day for some cheap sports entertainment and don't care if the team is still here next year or not.

If you can't get enough fans to buy tickets how can you expect enough of them to "Donate" money so you can have a team? A group of investors would be better than a group of fans. This sport has a history of burning markets, and the SIFL it seems is trying to become #1 in this area. Different leagues have tried to rebuild burnt markets and sometimes it's possible, but many times it's not. If you take the "Fans" money to pretend they are part of the ownership group, not only will they think you're a scum bucket when you fold, they'll call you a criminal and scam artist for stealing their money in the process. But I guess that would fit nicely into the SIFL business plan.

Yes, technically the SIFL and it's teams are classified as "Professional," but that's only because the players get paid to play. I know semi-pro players that get paid more than $200 per game. Unless you can pay the workers a living wage they are only part-time semi-pro and the term "Professional" is just an illusion to attract more butts in seats.

The posters on this forum are real fans, they hope for good owners to step up and build a stable franchise. If you turn out to fall into this catagory you will be praised and thanked for your efforts. The trouble is there seems to be a short supply of owners with the passion, finances, and knowledge of this type of business willing to give it a go. The knowledge of the history of the sport is enough for most savy businessmen to walk away.

So I wish you all the best, I just hope you know more about the subject than you're letting on. God Speed, you're going to need it. It's a good thing this league was built because God issued the command for it to be done.

jerry101jlh
Site Admin
Posts: 1474
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 7:37 pm

Post by jerry101jlh » Thu Aug 11, 2011 2:23 pm

[quote=""JayLawrence""]To make this EXTREMELY CLEAR...............

WE ONLY SIGNED A LOI WITH THE SIFL!

Look, did I ever say, "I have the money, myself, to do this!" NO! But, you can't say my team and I aren't working our butts off to make it happen or that our motives are selfish. We know WHEN this happens, we will have accomplished a lot. How about, if you people ARE real fans and care about Indoor/arena football, you embrace us and try to help us rather than drag us down. Wouldn't you like to have all pro sports teams sell the team to the people who live in their community?[/quote]

Do you have any real idea how many fans have embraced and helped their team only to see it fold because it was poorly managed or under capitalized? There are many fans right now, a couple on this board in fact, that were great fans of their now lost team. Are we skeptical of anyone that comes into the arena at this point and time, darn right we are, but we do wish you well in your effort so that fans in your area don't get burned like so many fans in other areas have.

As pointed out you lessen your chances for success just because of the league you are looking to join and on top of that choose an area that has another indoor team. Want more, Florida in general has failed at the box office where indoor football is concerned despite some very hard work by a few in some cases. Want more, travel. Right now looks like your travel may be quite expensive. I know, other teams coming on board or might, but who is telling you that, the SIFL or the teams themselves? And are these potential teams anymore financially viable than yours? List goes on and on, so excuse us for doubting you might have the success plan in hand.

jimsmith
Site Admin
Posts: 23
Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:07 am

Post by jimsmith » Thu Aug 11, 2011 5:00 pm

it's hard to believe your selling the concept of we will raise money by selling shares to the fans. Last I checked we are in a down economy. What about the fact that your trying to put a team in a location where another team the Florida Tarpons play. I looked at the 2 different buildings online and give me a break you are trying to play at the worst arena and be team number 2 in your own town. pipe dreams are just that pipe dreams.

Post Reply

Return to “SIFL”