[quote=""CHris902""]What do you do if you have a team with tons of money running around refusing to pay bills, yanking the league around, demanding that games only be played when they want them to be played, (and only two dates? What if another team actually beats them in one of the first two games?) and burning treating other teams like absolute crap? I am not sure that, given the circumstances, the PBL had any other option.
That said, there should have been mechanisms in place in advance of the season starting that would provide the league with other discplinary options. In addition, the Capitanes' lawyer has a good argument about the Doc, Doyle and Rochester being in conflict of interest. They need to bring in a third party commissioner or have a non-owner judicial board or something.[/quote]
All good points. I think there are a lot of people that have never been comfortable with that Roch / PBL conflict of interest and there was much speculation last year when it was decided to just have a one game championship game at Rochester. Especially when Battle creek had the higher seed. I think I stated this correctly
Puerto Rico has just dropped out of the PBL
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Ken, Steelheads fan
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[quote=""CHris902""]What do you do if you have a team with tons of money running around refusing to pay bills...[/quote]
You have the Halifax Rainmen. They have money for charter planes, but refuse to repay their OWN bank loan.
[quote=""LightningMan""]I' m with you.
As ugly and self serving to Rochester as this appears, if any of the facts about payment and playoff dates are correct, what alternative was the PBL left with? If the Capitanes were allowed to do this with impunity, a lot of the same people moaning about the expulsion would instead be moaning about the PBL not acting like a league.[/quote]
The PBL was guilty of not acting like a league from day one by not requiring a performance bond.
You have the Halifax Rainmen. They have money for charter planes, but refuse to repay their OWN bank loan.
[quote=""LightningMan""]I' m with you.
As ugly and self serving to Rochester as this appears, if any of the facts about payment and playoff dates are correct, what alternative was the PBL left with? If the Capitanes were allowed to do this with impunity, a lot of the same people moaning about the expulsion would instead be moaning about the PBL not acting like a league.[/quote]
The PBL was guilty of not acting like a league from day one by not requiring a performance bond.
First, with Doyles statement. We know for sure that this is not the entire story. Confussed, they should be kicked out for not paying. This is Battle Creek all over again. Why should teams pay what they owe, when the league won't. I checked yesterday. PBL ownership still has not paid for the hotel or bus in BC, but Doyle is going to help Halifax get there money. Lets remember, First the league told Battle Creek they had to telivise the game with at least 5 camera's. That was set up so the Championship could be played in BC. Then Doyle said that would not work cause they would have to move things back a day or two. He said the league had to be finished, it had run long. This year is running longer then last. Then when BC said they were not coming the league offered BC 25 grand to play the game and $500.00 to each of the players. The league sent BC 5 grand and said that was all they were sending. That is what they did. So tell me what is the diffrence in The PBL leadership and the team from PR. I guess it is a little of there own medcine. PR don't pay your bills untill the PBL pays there bills. Plus I heard that the league was supposed to pay some of that money. Just like they helped Detroit out last year. When they ran out of money, the league helped pay the players. This drama has just stared, can't wait to see what the next couple of weeks will bring. Say good bye to the PBL. Who are the teams waiting to get into this wonderful league.
[quote=""Juniper""]Lets remember, First the league told Battle Creek they had to telivise the game with at least 5 camera's. That was set up so the Championship could be played in BC. Then Doyle said that would not work cause they would have to move things back a day or two. He said the league had to be finished, it had run long. This year is running longer then last. Then when BC said they were not coming the league offered BC 25 grand to play the game and $500.00 to each of the players. The league sent BC 5 grand and said that was all they were sending. That is what they did. [/quote]
Despite asking you numerous times for evidence, I have never seen anything besides yours and sonny's posts to suggest that this is true.
Despite asking you numerous times for evidence, I have never seen anything besides yours and sonny's posts to suggest that this is true.
PBL Unpaid bills in Battle Creek
[quote=""CHris902""]Despite asking you numerous times for evidence, I have never seen anything besides yours and sonny's posts to suggest that this is true.[/quote]
$4,087 (includes interest)to Starlight Tours and Travel 269-969-9900. The original bill was $10,225. $6,000+ has been paid. When you call ask for Denise.
$ 614 to Mccamly Plaza Hotel 269-969-4717. Ask for Michelle Martin or accounts receivable.
$20,000 to Battle Creek Knights ($5,000 already paid ) for verbal agreement to give up home court advantage and play a one game championship in Rochester. Scott Niecko former Knight co-owner can be reached at sniecko22@yahoo.com.
$1,200 to Battle Creek Knights for travel reimbursement never paid.
$25,901 Grand Total
$4,087 (includes interest)to Starlight Tours and Travel 269-969-9900. The original bill was $10,225. $6,000+ has been paid. When you call ask for Denise.
$ 614 to Mccamly Plaza Hotel 269-969-4717. Ask for Michelle Martin or accounts receivable.
$20,000 to Battle Creek Knights ($5,000 already paid ) for verbal agreement to give up home court advantage and play a one game championship in Rochester. Scott Niecko former Knight co-owner can be reached at sniecko22@yahoo.com.
$1,200 to Battle Creek Knights for travel reimbursement never paid.
$25,901 Grand Total
[quote=""basketball facts""]Sounds more like a fact than an armchair quaterback. A team has dropped from your league, do not say that it is the ecomonies fault. They dropped out before play-offs. If this was the ABA, guys would be calling for peoples heads. A fact is a fact. [/quote]
If this was the ABA, the team would have only played two or three games before disappearing.
If this was the ABA, nobody would have said a word - the team would have just disappeared. Or they would have made up some bogus number about what it costs to fly to their next game.
Oh, and if this was the ABA, this would be just one of twenty or more franchise foldings over the course of a season.
So, yeah, the ABA sucks worse.
If this was the ABA, the team would have only played two or three games before disappearing.
If this was the ABA, nobody would have said a word - the team would have just disappeared. Or they would have made up some bogus number about what it costs to fly to their next game.
Oh, and if this was the ABA, this would be just one of twenty or more franchise foldings over the course of a season.
So, yeah, the ABA sucks worse.
Old enough to remember when bashing the ABA was fun.
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The Sweeper
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"Official" statement
http://www.thepbl.com/article.cfm?id=285
PBL EXPELS CAPITANES FROM LEAGUE
03/30/2010 12:00 PM
Based on failure to adhere to league rules, threats by the team of not showing up for road games, and a direct lack of communication with the league office and its fellow teams, the Puerto Rico Capitanes have been dismissed from the Premier Basketball League.\\The Capitanes, who amassed a 14-3 record in the PBL, currently also participate as the Capitanes de Arecibo in the Baloncesto Superior Nacional (BSN), a professional basketball league in Puerto Rico.
This is not a decision that was lightly made, said Tom Doyle, President of the Premier Basketball League.\\We gave the Capitanes every chance to make things right, but their refusal to even adhere to the most important tenets of our league, regrettably left us with no choice.
Although the Capitanes were a tough opponent on the court, there were several off-court incidents involving travel and arrival to road games that also exacerbated relations between the PBL and the Capitanes.\\While the Capitanes were able to host home games for visiting PBL teams, road trips were another matter.
A road trip for the Capitanes on the weekend of February 27th-28th, that would have taken the Capitanes to Halifax and to Lawton-Fort Sill for two sell-out games was first compromised by a blizzard, stranding the Capitanes at an airport in Montreal.\\Rather than work with the PBL front office to seek alternative travel arrangements to get to Halifax, the Capitanes actually tried to buy tickets to return to Puerto Rico, which would have canceled the road trip and left two opponents the Halifax Rainmen and the Lawton-Fort Sill Cavalry with no opponent for their sold-out games.
A short bus ride to Toronto from Montreal (where the Capitanes were located after a game against Quebec), where a connecting flight to Halifax could have been procured, would have solved the travel problem, said Doyle.\\But the Capitanes unwillingness to board a bus panicked all of us.\\The Capitanes made their own decision to go to Rochester and fly back to Puerto Rico, only telling the PBL, Well, if you can find a miracle of 26 tickets we will go to Lawton; if not, we go home.\\Well, the PBL DID find a miracle that day, and acquired 26 tickets for a flight from Rochester to Oklahoma, so the game could go on as scheduled.
In addition, even as the Rainmen were able to reschedule their snowstorm-interrupted game against the Capitanes for March 27, there was some question as to whether the Capitanes would make the rescheduled date in Nova Scotia. The PBL understands the cost of travel, said Doyle.\\It is tempting to book tickets strictly by price, but you must allow enough time between connecting flights if you do not have a direct flight.\\The Capitanes booked their own travel for the make-up game they flew to Boston for the game, but were unable to catch their connecting flight to Halifax, in that it took off ten minutes after their Puerto Rico-to-Boston flight landed.\\Thats not enough time to get from one plane to another.\\An effort was made by the league to get them a chartered bus from Boston to Halifax, but they refused to take it they were going to instead return to Puerto Rico.\\Halifax had to pay out of pocket for a charter plane to bring the Capitanes to the MetroCentre, so as to not disappoint the fans who purchased tickets to that game.\\Puerto Rico left us with no choice.\\We are an independent minor league, and we travel by all means possible to get to our games.\\Playing our games is of paramount importance to us.\\Choosing to NOT play a game is NOT an option, and we try to do whatever it takes to make sure games are played.
In addition, the PBL is also investigating an incident at the Puerto Rico-Halifax game, in which Puerto Ricos Andres Rodrigues angrily flung a basketball at an official the official dodged to get out of the way, and the ball smashed into a childs face, who was sitting in a front-row seat.
We went above and beyond for the Capitanes, we paid for a chartered flight from Boston to Halifax, and that was only because they were going to stiff us and not show up at the building, said Andre Levingston, the President and CEO of the Rainmen.\\And the actions by Andres Rodrigues were absolutely unacceptable.
The league is also investigating claims of unpaid hotel and travel costs incurred by the Capitanes during their road trips to Quebec, Halifax and Maryland, of which the Capitanes were responsible for their own travel costs.\\The team also was very uncooperative with the PBL in terms of communication and contact.\\We have operational rules in the PBL, and we gave each team deadlines to meet those obligations, said Doyle.\\The Capitanes chose not to follow the rules, or to respond to us regarding those rules. We tried to communicate with the Capitanes, said Doyle, but our calls went unanswered.
There were also concerns regarding available playoff dates.\\Each team is required to submit a minimum of six arena availability dates to the PBL so that the playoff games can be properly scheduled.\\The Capitanes chose to only submit two home dates.
One game remains un-played; an April 3, 2010 home game for the Capitanes against the Rochester RazorSharks.\\The PBL is currently deciding how this game will be dealt with in the final standings.
The Capitanes exit means that two teams that were fighting for the fourth and final playoff spot, the Halifax Rainmen and the Vermont Frost Heaves, will now both enter the PBL playoffs, joining the Lawton-Fort Sill Cavalry and the Rochester RazorSharks.\\Playoff seeding is still to be determined.\\The PBLs regular season will end Saturday, April 10, with the playoffs to immediately follow.
PBL EXPELS CAPITANES FROM LEAGUE
03/30/2010 12:00 PM
Based on failure to adhere to league rules, threats by the team of not showing up for road games, and a direct lack of communication with the league office and its fellow teams, the Puerto Rico Capitanes have been dismissed from the Premier Basketball League.\\The Capitanes, who amassed a 14-3 record in the PBL, currently also participate as the Capitanes de Arecibo in the Baloncesto Superior Nacional (BSN), a professional basketball league in Puerto Rico.
This is not a decision that was lightly made, said Tom Doyle, President of the Premier Basketball League.\\We gave the Capitanes every chance to make things right, but their refusal to even adhere to the most important tenets of our league, regrettably left us with no choice.
Although the Capitanes were a tough opponent on the court, there were several off-court incidents involving travel and arrival to road games that also exacerbated relations between the PBL and the Capitanes.\\While the Capitanes were able to host home games for visiting PBL teams, road trips were another matter.
A road trip for the Capitanes on the weekend of February 27th-28th, that would have taken the Capitanes to Halifax and to Lawton-Fort Sill for two sell-out games was first compromised by a blizzard, stranding the Capitanes at an airport in Montreal.\\Rather than work with the PBL front office to seek alternative travel arrangements to get to Halifax, the Capitanes actually tried to buy tickets to return to Puerto Rico, which would have canceled the road trip and left two opponents the Halifax Rainmen and the Lawton-Fort Sill Cavalry with no opponent for their sold-out games.
A short bus ride to Toronto from Montreal (where the Capitanes were located after a game against Quebec), where a connecting flight to Halifax could have been procured, would have solved the travel problem, said Doyle.\\But the Capitanes unwillingness to board a bus panicked all of us.\\The Capitanes made their own decision to go to Rochester and fly back to Puerto Rico, only telling the PBL, Well, if you can find a miracle of 26 tickets we will go to Lawton; if not, we go home.\\Well, the PBL DID find a miracle that day, and acquired 26 tickets for a flight from Rochester to Oklahoma, so the game could go on as scheduled.
In addition, even as the Rainmen were able to reschedule their snowstorm-interrupted game against the Capitanes for March 27, there was some question as to whether the Capitanes would make the rescheduled date in Nova Scotia. The PBL understands the cost of travel, said Doyle.\\It is tempting to book tickets strictly by price, but you must allow enough time between connecting flights if you do not have a direct flight.\\The Capitanes booked their own travel for the make-up game they flew to Boston for the game, but were unable to catch their connecting flight to Halifax, in that it took off ten minutes after their Puerto Rico-to-Boston flight landed.\\Thats not enough time to get from one plane to another.\\An effort was made by the league to get them a chartered bus from Boston to Halifax, but they refused to take it they were going to instead return to Puerto Rico.\\Halifax had to pay out of pocket for a charter plane to bring the Capitanes to the MetroCentre, so as to not disappoint the fans who purchased tickets to that game.\\Puerto Rico left us with no choice.\\We are an independent minor league, and we travel by all means possible to get to our games.\\Playing our games is of paramount importance to us.\\Choosing to NOT play a game is NOT an option, and we try to do whatever it takes to make sure games are played.
In addition, the PBL is also investigating an incident at the Puerto Rico-Halifax game, in which Puerto Ricos Andres Rodrigues angrily flung a basketball at an official the official dodged to get out of the way, and the ball smashed into a childs face, who was sitting in a front-row seat.
We went above and beyond for the Capitanes, we paid for a chartered flight from Boston to Halifax, and that was only because they were going to stiff us and not show up at the building, said Andre Levingston, the President and CEO of the Rainmen.\\And the actions by Andres Rodrigues were absolutely unacceptable.
The league is also investigating claims of unpaid hotel and travel costs incurred by the Capitanes during their road trips to Quebec, Halifax and Maryland, of which the Capitanes were responsible for their own travel costs.\\The team also was very uncooperative with the PBL in terms of communication and contact.\\We have operational rules in the PBL, and we gave each team deadlines to meet those obligations, said Doyle.\\The Capitanes chose not to follow the rules, or to respond to us regarding those rules. We tried to communicate with the Capitanes, said Doyle, but our calls went unanswered.
There were also concerns regarding available playoff dates.\\Each team is required to submit a minimum of six arena availability dates to the PBL so that the playoff games can be properly scheduled.\\The Capitanes chose to only submit two home dates.
One game remains un-played; an April 3, 2010 home game for the Capitanes against the Rochester RazorSharks.\\The PBL is currently deciding how this game will be dealt with in the final standings.
The Capitanes exit means that two teams that were fighting for the fourth and final playoff spot, the Halifax Rainmen and the Vermont Frost Heaves, will now both enter the PBL playoffs, joining the Lawton-Fort Sill Cavalry and the Rochester RazorSharks.\\Playoff seeding is still to be determined.\\The PBLs regular season will end Saturday, April 10, with the playoffs to immediately follow.
Mean Spirited Blogger #37
Honored to have been the 13th player for the Vermont Frost Heaves game on 2-16-07 against the Maryland Nighthawks.
The ABA is the basketball equivalent of Amp'd Mobile.
Honored to have been the 13th player for the Vermont Frost Heaves game on 2-16-07 against the Maryland Nighthawks.
The ABA is the basketball equivalent of Amp'd Mobile.
PR is gone. They screwed the league over. PBL can figure out their next moves. PBL and Halifax bent over backwards to assist PR. Didnt work, bottom line is PR did not want to go to HAL and then to LAwton to get whooped twice. But playoffs are ahead:
LFS vs Hal/Vermont
Roc vs Hal/Vermont
Winners meet. We have PBL Champion.
LFS vs Hal/Vermont
Roc vs Hal/Vermont
Winners meet. We have PBL Champion.
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LightningMan
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- Location: Wilmington, NC
[quote=""time out""]$4,087 (includes interest)to Starlight Tours and Travel 269-969-9900. The original bill was $10,225. $6,000+ has been paid. When you call ask for Denise.
$ 614 to Mccamly Plaza Hotel 269-969-4717. Ask for Michelle Martin or accounts receivable.
$20,000 to Battle Creek Knights ($5,000 already paid ) for verbal agreement to give up home court advantage and play a one game championship in Rochester. Scott Niecko former Knight co-owner can be reached at sniecko22@yahoo.com.
$1,200 to Battle Creek Knights for travel reimbursement never paid.
$25,901 Grand Total[/quote]
This is a nice itemized list, but it's evidence of unpaid bills, not evidence that the PBL committed to giving the money. And forget interest.
$ 614 to Mccamly Plaza Hotel 269-969-4717. Ask for Michelle Martin or accounts receivable.
$20,000 to Battle Creek Knights ($5,000 already paid ) for verbal agreement to give up home court advantage and play a one game championship in Rochester. Scott Niecko former Knight co-owner can be reached at sniecko22@yahoo.com.
$1,200 to Battle Creek Knights for travel reimbursement never paid.
$25,901 Grand Total[/quote]
This is a nice itemized list, but it's evidence of unpaid bills, not evidence that the PBL committed to giving the money. And forget interest.
I'm making some calls to find out.
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