Ice Dogs to Ontario, CA?

[OneBetter]

I heard several rumors a while back that the defunct Long Beach Ice Dogs may move to Ontario once their arena opens next fall. Has anyone heard anything on this topic?

I know the D-League Los Angeles Defenders will be moving to the arena. It seems like it would be a prime place for an ECHL team as well.

[boing]

The Ice Dogs can't move to Ontario, as they were dissolved by the league and no longer exist, even on paper. They will either have to apply for an expansion team or secure an existing team. Coincidentally, Barry Kemp owns the Texas Wildcatters and they are averaging 1300 per game. I've read rumors that Texas might move to Ontario for next season....

[Dilbert]

http://ontarioprohockey.com/

No logo yet but the team weather it is expansion or another team moving is the Ontario Reign. I have a feeling that Reading will loose its affiliation with Los Angeles and Manchester.

[Minor League Man]

http://ontarioprohockey.com/

No logo yet but the team weather it is expansion or another team moving is the Ontario Reign. I have a feeling that Reading will loose its affiliation with Los Angeles and Manchester.
Yeah, I'm afraid of that too...

Then again, the first year the ECHL was on the West Coast, both the Fresno Falcons AND the Johnstown Chiefs had San Jose and Cleveland for farm teams...

[BBallFan - Long Island]

The Reading franchise is well run with a good fan base. NHL (or AHL) teams with a struggling ECHL/CHL situation could look to affilliate if the Kings / Monarchs go bye bye. The only only downside for Reading is that the city is not served by commercial airlines (but hey, this is a bus league isn't it!)

BTW - anyone seen a recent Death Pool report?

[Pounder]

Why presume that the Kings wouldn't sell their share of the Royals?

Hans hasn't fired up a Death Pool report yet. I don't think there's any pressing situations yet. Reading is an affiliation issue (and probably is just an ownership change away), and CHL Youngstown is going to be a "which league" issue. I hear Mississippi isn't doing so well, and everyone knows about Texas, but nothing sticks out as a potential mid-season fold.

[OneBetter]

If the Ontario franchise is good to go, then why hasn't the ECHL updated their "Other Markets" page? It seems like they'd want to start publicizing this team!!!


It sounds like a few franchises are in trouble. Are they possible folds after the season? Do you guys see any of them sticking it out another year where they are? Are any speculated to move?

What about additional expansion? Has the Burlington, VT franchise died before it ever got off the ground? Are there any rumors about San Diego getting a team again? That's a great minor league hockey town. Any other cities rumored to get a team?

It appears at least on the surface that the CHL has been much more stable the past few years than the ECHL.

[Shootmaster_44]

If the Ontario franchise is good to go, then why hasn't the ECHL updated their "Other Markets" page? It seems like they'd want to start publicizing this team!!!


It sounds like a few franchises are in trouble. Are they possible folds after the season? Do you guys see any of them sticking it out another year where they are? Are any speculated to move?

What about additional expansion? Has the Burlington, VT franchise died before it ever got off the ground? Are there any rumors about San Diego getting a team again? That's a great minor league hockey town. Any other cities rumored to get a team?

It appears at least on the surface that the CHL has been much more stable the past few years than the ECHL.

I have read elsewhere that the ECHL isn't officially interested in Ontario, CA. That's why they don't have them listed under future markets. My guess is that the Ontario Reign will be a moved team, not an expansion team.

As far as an affiliation goes, I think the Kings may test the waters with two teams next season. The reason they will do so is that if the Ontario team is a flop as far as attendance goes or any of the other reason the Southern California ECHL teams have died, they haven't burnt their bridge in Reading.

The fans in Reading are a little annoyed that they continually have talent dumped on them by the Kings. What I mean is that they have prospects who are simply playing out their Kings contracts (especially goalies) in Reading. The Kings have no plans for those players in the future, so they don't do anything to help them develop (i.e. send goaltending consultants to Reading etc.), but require the Royals to play these players. So if the Kings dumped Reading as an affiliate the Royals fans wouldn't be upset.

[boing]

I think Burlington disappeared because the arena was never built. It's not likely San Diego will get another team because there are rumors that the decripit arena there is to be redeveloped.

It's sort of funny that hockey has died in San Diego.
The ECHL/WCHL team averaged 5000-6000 fans per game and when the last round of NHL expansion in the 90s went on, San Diego was on the list of expansion cities, but could not build a modern arena.
Sad.

[Pounder]

There are some published rumors that one of the outlying San Diego casinos wants to build a mid-sized arena and bring hockey back to Lo-Cal. I figure I'd have heard something more if any progress were being made.

[aardvark]

There are some published rumors that one of the outlying San Diego casinos wants to build a mid-sized arena and bring hockey back to Lo-Cal. I figure I'd have heard something more if any progress were being made.

Apparently I have not seen these published rumors. When? Who? Where? This would be the only way we would ever get hockey back in San Diego, because if you have been to the San Diego Sports Arena lately, you would know that it is a DUMP!

[Pounder]

http://www.intotheboards.net/vbforums/showthread.php?t=1757

OK, so maybe it wouldn't be associated with a casino.

[Dilbert]

Okay I want to know which arena is worse

San Diego Sports Arena in San Diego or 1st Mariner Arena in Baltimore?

[rams80]

Okay I want to know which arena is worse

San Diego Sports Arena in San Diego or 1st Mariner Arena in Baltimore?

Isn't 1st Mariner in a bad part of town.

[aardvark]

Okay I want to know which arena is worse

San Diego Sports Arena in San Diego or 1st Mariner Arena in Baltimore?
I don't know--I've never been to Baltimore--but San Diego's arena is pretty sad. No more hockey in that building.

[aardvark]

http://www.intotheboards.net/vbforums/showthread.php?t=1757

OK, so maybe it wouldn't be associated with a casino.

Thanks for the link. If AEG wants to "renovate" the arena, they should start with a wrecking ball.

[S.Sox]

How about Reno/Sparks Nevada, They are building a new 7500 seat arena at the "Legends at Sparks Marina" developement.


http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071027/BIZ/710270319/1071

S.Sox

[Geoff]

What about it? D oyou mean which league will get the lease? The ECHL has a franchise ready to go the owner has been paying the membership fees for a few years now and is just waiting for an arena to try and land a lease. Meanwhile, the CHL is also trying to land a lease in Reno and they seem to be behind as they don't currently have an ownership group/franchise.

[Pounder]

S.- Is it being built, or is it still in planning stage?

[Pounder]

Managed to get an answer to my question, when I googled "Legends at Sparks Marina arena." I did pass by the development to and from Sacramento over the weekend. The answer:

http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080208/SPARKS/802080484/1251/NEIGHBORHOODS04

Still in "study" stage, but given the scope of the project, you could figure that this will eventually get built. What's going up now is clearly not an arena, though it looks pretty darn big.

[Dan K]

Wasn't the Legends project originally supposed to include a ballpark for a PCL team, but that was changed when the buyer of the Tucson Sidewinders was able to get a deal completed for a downtown ballpark?

The Reno Rage last played in the 1997-98 West Coast Hockey League. Prior to that the team was called the Reno Renegades (1995-97). The Rage suspended operations and were purchased out of bankruptcy. The new owner changed the name to the Reno Raiders and eventually came over to the ECHL as a dormant expansion franchise in the 2003 merger of the two leagues. The Raiders have been waiting for a new arena and the Legends project could be their chance.

[Pounder]

The Legends project wasn't "originally" slated to have the ballpark, from what I read. However, that was soon incorporated into the plan. Obviously, it's been unincorporated. I do believe the arena concept started factoring in even before the ballpark issue was decided, most likely while the baseball stadium funding was in the "dragging along" phase.

[Pounder]

BTW, it's official. Ontario is inheriting the Texas Wildcatters.

http://www.echl.com/cgi-bin/mpublic.cgi?action=show_news&cat=1&id=14123

My sympathies go out to those in Beaumont... and Columbia.

[rams80]

So much for that "Reading to Ontario" idea in the AHL thread.

Also...RIP Columbia.

[Shootmaster_44]

So much for that "Reading to Ontario" idea in the AHL thread.

Also...RIP Columbia.

Looks like the speculation I had heard out of Reading was wrong. Now the big question is what happens to the affiliations? Do the Kings really try and keep two affiliates in the ECHL?

[Minor League Man]

Looks like the speculation I had heard out of Reading was wrong. Now the big question is what happens to the affiliations? Do the Kings really try and keep two affiliates in the ECHL?
Well, the San Jose Sharks tried it once with the Fresno Falcons and Johnstown Chiefs...I don't see why the LA Kings can't do the same.

[Dan K]

I purchased the ECHL's 20-year history book. I was particularly interested in the lineage of the various franchises. The book does confirm the Beach Dogs' membership was terminated after the 2006-07 season. The book lists the Myrtle Beach franchise as "awaiting completion of new arena" and is the transferred Florence (SC) Pride franchise. There is also no mention of Burlington (VT), which was at one time supposed to get the Lexington Men O' War franchise, but the dormant Lexington franchise became the Utah Grizzlies. The book also lists Toledo as "awaiting completion of new arena".

[garcia33]

texas will be moving to california next season..what we really need is two maybe 3 more teams per divison. my home team is the stockton thunder.. it would be great if reno or sacramento could get a team 4 teams on hwy 99.. thats awsome. the texas move was the talk of the ALL-STAR game this season, in stockton.