ownership change in Minot soon

[Cazzzmo]

FRONT PAGE OF THE LOCAL PAPER:

http://www.minotdailynews.com/News/articles.asp?articleID=17211

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[MontanaFella]

Hopefully it is a better situation that what the Explorers got in the Tuckman debacle.

[bectond]

This is great news, ownership groups with 20 or more members have a much better chance of surviving long-term:

1- If the team is a SP, once that owner dies or gets tired of his toy the whole franchise goes under.

2-If the team losses money (say 150,000); that equals out to about $7,500 per owner, which is a workable figure (and nice tax write-off).

Apex is down to Butte and the rights to the defunct Utah Eagles. The question now is this: who will be the first to relocate to Wenathcee, Tuckman (Great Falls) or Apex (Butte)? I believe Hunter was given a franchise as well when he bolted after SF and Dakota left for the D League. I believe he is a westerner as well.

[Pounder]

Is Butte bad off enough to warrant moving? Guess I wasn't getting that impression.

Wenatchee's arena saga is quite the curiosity to me. It amuses me (and makes sense, BTW) that the CBA could beat hockey to this place.

[besl]

Is Butte bad off enough to warrant moving? Guess I wasn't getting that impression.

Wenatchee's arena saga is quite the curiosity to me. It amuses me (and makes sense, BTW) that the CBA could beat hockey to this place.

What hockey teams would even be candidates for Wenatchee? Last I heard the WHL wasn't interested in expanding and I don't know of any teams interested in relocating. I suppose an ECHL team could make a decent travel partner with Victoria and/or Idaho. It seems Wenatchee is best suited (geographically speaking, at least) for a team in the old WCHL.

[kg21obf]

Wenatchee is a very small town. It would be very surprising if they wouldnt join the 1000 fans per nite range. Plus lots of Retirees and 2nd home people in the area.

[Ken, Steelheads fan]

This is great news, ownership groups with 20 or more members have a much better chance of surviving long-term:

1- If the team is a SP, once that owner dies or gets tired of his toy the whole franchise goes under.

2-If the team losses money (say 150,000); that equals out to about $7,500 per owner, which is a workable figure (and nice tax write-off).

Apex is down to Butte and the rights to the defunct Utah Eagles. The question now is this: who will be the first to relocate to Wenathcee, Tuckman (Great Falls) or Apex (Butte)? I believe Hunter was given a franchise as well when he bolted after SF and Dakota left for the D League. I believe he is a westerner as well.

I'll bet you dollars to donuts that these 20+ owners are actually 20+ current sponsors trying to protect their interests for this season only. What have I been saying about these broke multi-team ownership groups? When they fold, all their teams fold with them. Apex is toast.

[Pounder]

What hockey teams would even be candidates for Wenatchee? Last I heard the WHL wasn't interested in expanding and I don't know of any teams interested in relocating. I suppose an ECHL team could make a decent travel partner with Victoria and/or Idaho. It seems Wenatchee is best suited (geographically speaking, at least) for a team in the old WCHL.

They were aiming for Tier 2's vaunted BCHL. Thing is, they'll have an arena that's WHL-sized IMO (OK, just 700 seats short of Tri-City's Toyota Center).

BTW, they had the BCHL team secured, then the sale didn't finish in time, then USA Hockey required the ownership group to complete something new about WHY an American city should host a Canadian junior team... (noting the whole freaking US Division in the WHL and former BCHL teams in Bellingham and Spokane). One wonders if USA Hockey is going to turn around next and try to whammy the current American-based CHL Major Junior teams.

Latest word is that, get this, they're now aiming for NAHL. That would be the league where the closest rival is probably Bismarck.

[bectond]

I'll bet you dollars to donuts that these 20+ owners are actually 20+ current sponsors trying to protect their interests for this season only. What have I been saying about these broke multi-team ownership groups? When they fold, all their teams fold with them. Apex is toast.

I agree, most of the current sponsors most likely joined the ownership group.
However, I disagree with your assertion that they will fold and that Apex is toast.

You should give Apex a break Ken, they took on multiple teams to save the league. They most likely only paid for one franchise, the other three were most likely given to them by the league for them to sell at a later date for a profit. Thus far, the Minot sale is the only positive. I doubt they sold Great Falls to Tuckman, Utah is still in limbo and Butte is not drawing worth a darn.

The problem with Apex is that they only hired one seasoned executive (Minot's G.M.). I don't know who's running the other franchises. If they can find a buyer for the Utah franchise, relocate the Butte franchise and hire someone that can attract sponsors, sell season tickets and increase group sales, then they have a future. I suggest moving to Wenatchee and finding a buyer in Utah (I believe St.George has been suggested). If those to things take place, Apex is still looking good IMHO.

[bectond]

Wenatchee is a very small town. It would be very surprising if they wouldnt join the 1000 fans per nite range. Plus lots of Retirees and 2nd home people in the area.

Your from that area right? Do you think Wenatchee could support a franchise? Would Yakama fans travel to games in Wenatchee and vice versa?

[Ken, Steelheads fan]

I agree, most of the current sponsors most likely joined the ownership group.
However, I disagree with your assertion that they will fold and that Apex is toast.

You should give Apex a break Ken, they took on multiple teams to save the league. They most likely only paid for one franchise, the other three were most likely given to them by the league for them to sell at a later date for a profit. Thus far, the Minot sale is the only positive. I doubt they sold Great Falls to Tuckman, Utah is still in limbo and Butte is not drawing worth a darn.

The problem with Apex is that they only hired one seasoned executive (Minot's G.M.). I don't know who's running the other franchises. If they can find a buyer for the Utah franchise, relocate the Butte franchise and hire someone that can attract sponsors, sell season tickets and increase group sales, then they have a future. I suggest moving to Wenatchee and finding a buyer in Utah (I believe St.George has been suggested). If those to things take place, Apex is still looking good IMHO.


There ya' go with all those If's again. I'll stand by EVERYTHING I've said about Apex in the past, present, and will say in the future. Why run multiple franchises and do a lousy job on each team when they could have put a maximum effort into one solid franchise?

[Chuck the Writer]

Let me ask this - if there is new ownership in Minot, can they please replace the broadcaster on the webcast? I mean, "Two points by a Patroon" just ain't going to cut it. And if you're going to announce the players, at least look at the notes - It's Jamaal Miller, not Milner, for god sakes! And if they're going to take a time out, could the broadcaster PUHLEEZE go over some statistics? And the town's name is ALL-Bany, not EHL-Bany. We don't pronounce the Skyrockets' home franchise as "Minnow," for example...

By the way, did she call Ray Cunningham a rookie?? Is this the same Ray Cunningham that not only played in the ABA two years ago, but in Minot last season??? Or is there a second Ray Cunningham out there that I don't know about?

And she's so amazed that the Skyrockets have little games in between time outs for the fans! God almighty!

[heavesrock]

Amen to Chuck's comment. THe announcer is so bad I'm watching the Yakama-Pittsburgh game instead. What to do when that game ends?

[Chuck the Writer]

Well, after a quarter of no video, we now have audio and what looks like a screen capture of somebody's computer screen. Ray Cunningham is still a rookie, though...

John Strickland does not need to take free throw lessons from Shaq, Barbie.

It would be nice if she told us which Patroon tried to shoot from three-point range, instead of telling us, "From downtown - no good."

I can hear Coach Askew through her speakers, he calls a better game than SHE does!

[psbf]

to what Chuck is saying. I've heard her. She has a lot of learning to do!

As far as the xplosion game, with all due respect to the Sun Kings, shoulda woulda coulda. That's all I have to say in the 97-93 X loss.

[Chuck the Writer]

to what Chuck is saying. I've heard her. She has a lot of learning to do!

As far as the xplosion game, with all due respect to the Sun Kings, shoulda woulda coulda. That's all I have to say in the 97-93 X loss.

The coup de grace came during the fourth quarter, when she corrected herself and called Ray Cunningham "a rookie that played here last year."

HAH??

A rookie that played here last year?

And before anybody gets on the Patroons' case for not even having a functioning webcast at the moment, let me remind you that I would rather listen to Dick Vitale read The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe (It's turkish delight, bay-bee!) than listen to this dimbulb in front of the microphone again.

Yeesh.

[Minor Leaguer]

Chuck, while I agree that Minot's webcast announcer doesn't have a clue, at least you have the option of turning off the volume. Since you are a person familiar with the CBA, I bet you would be able to tell which players are which and not really have to rely on the play-by-play or lack thereof in Minot. You try and defend the fact that the Patroons don't even have webcasts, yet I would rather be able to watch a game with no volume than not have any game to watch, which is the case in Albany.

[psbf]

any of the Skyrockets webcasts, Minerleaguer, you may know that the webcam is too far from the play to get a good look at the numbers.

[Chuck the Writer]

Chuck, while I agree that Minot's webcast announcer doesn't have a clue, at least you have the option of turning off the volume.

Well, for a while we just had the volume and no picture, which helped not a bit. Thank God the Dakstats was working.

Since you are a person familiar with the CBA, I bet you would be able to tell which players are which and not really have to rely on the play-by-play or lack thereof in Minot.

Again, you're making assumptions based on your own interpretation of what was previously posted. By your argument, I should know every CBA player from 100 yards away, as "a person familiar with the CBA." Which, if you've seen the Minot video feed - or almost any of the video feeds - it's extremely hard to pick out players from where the cameras are located (mostly in the back row, so that one camera can pan left and right). Only East Kentucky has sideline cameras at their feeds. That feed is so bad I had to concentrate just to see Darius Mattear's dreadlocks and John Strickland's clown shoes on the court - and that only lasted for two quarters before the video conked out and all I was left with was Barbie.

You try and defend the fact that the Patroons don't even have webcasts, yet I would rather be able to watch a game with no volume than not have any game to watch, which is the case in Albany.

Again, making assumptions. All I said was that the Patroons' webcast wasn't working. That doesn't detract from my original post, that Barbie for the Skyrockets was so bad she made Suzyn Waldman sound like Lesley Visser. Oklahoma didn't have their video feed working, and neither did Atlanta. But at least all four games were played. Can you say the same about the ABA?

Didn't think so.

[Minor Leaguer]

Chuck, quit already with your assumption BS already. You posted it and I simply responded. Now you come back with the fact that Oklahoma and Atlanta didn't have their webcast working. Well congratulations, do you really want to compare the Patroons, the CBA's most storied franchise, to the Oklahoma Calvary and the Atlanta Krunk? Then you go on to compare the CBA to the ABA. Why do people continue to do this? It is obvious that the CBA is above and beyond the ABA. The ABA is a joke, it is not a basketball league. Please do not compare any basketball league to the ABA.

[Chuck the Writer]

Chuck, quit already with your assumption BS already.

Already getting hostile already, are we already?

You posted it and I simply responded.

You posted that I should be able to tell the players about, because, in your words, "you are a person familiar with the CBA." As I've said before, the feed from most of these Web Television Network broadcasts are barely above YouTube quality, and one really needs to have some sort of auxiliary information source accompanying the product. For those teams who ARE able to provide a video feed, they often simulcast the radio feed. This happens in Yakama and in East Kentucky. If Minot did this with their radio feed, it would be sufficient. Unfortunately, we've got Barbie doing the broadcast. So as I've said before, it was extremely difficult to follow the game when one could barely make out who was who on the video feed, and Barbie was barely providing any sort of cohesive or coherent commentary on the game.

Now you come back with the fact that Oklahoma and Atlanta didn't have their webcast working.

They didn't.

Well congratulations, do you really want to compare the Patroons, the CBA's most storied franchise, to the Oklahoma Calvary and the Atlanta Krunk?

Again, you're making more comparisons than I am.

I never made any comparison about whether Albany is better or worse than Oklahoma or Atlanta (although on the court, Albany is 2-0 against the Cavalry and 3-2 against the Krunk, if you want to compare that).

Then you go on to compare the CBA to the ABA. Why do people continue to do this? It is obvious that the CBA is above and beyond the ABA.

Gee, that sounds like a comparison from you.

The ABA is a joke, it is not a basketball league. Please do not compare any basketball league to the ABA.

Son, it's really not a good idea to dictate to me who I can and can't compare teams or leagues to. Really not. 'Kay?

[jbirdmontana]

Damn yall take it easy before someone gets hurt lol. It just is nice that some of the teams actually have the stats tracker going. I know that Great Falls doesn't have anything at all online, and I don't thing RGV does either. But why would that surprise me, my hometown Explorers can't do anything right this season.

[Minor Leaguer]

Ok Pops, I just might listen to you!

I just find it really funny how you always want to compare your team (the Patroons) to the teams who aren't doing things right. Like I said at least the Skyrockets have a webcast, no matter how bad it might be. The same can't be said for the Patroons.

Just keep shooting your photos and pretending that Albany can do no wrong.

[Chuck the Writer]

Ok Pops, I just might listen to you!

And you might just learn something.

Just keep shooting your photos and pretending that Albany can do no wrong.

Oh yeah... I forgot about your issues regarding my photography at games and my protection of copyright.

Alright Chuck, keep on waiting for somebody to pay you that nice lump sum of money that you evidently think you are going to get from your photograph of Jamario Moon. My point is somebody was using the pic on a blog. Big deal, who cares? You can't tell me that he was using it to make money. That is just ridiculous! Next you are going to start talking about how you could get paid for pics of Michael Ray Richardson that you took last season too I suppose. You talk about how you have made money from the trading cards and the Patroons dance team. That is a little bit different than making money from a national company or the NBA from your photos. You have had an in with the Patroons for a while now and of course that doesn't hurt when it comes to them wanting something done with photography.

Well then, I should tell you that the print edition of the New Jersey Star-Ledger today ran two photos of mine from the Albany-Atlanta home opener (it was part of an article on Atlanta's Zach Marbury). They bought the photos, ran the photos as part of the article that ran today, and are sending me a good check as payment for my work.

And THAT is why you protect your copyright on photography. QED.

[cat1bb1]

Chuck! Congrats!

Minor Leaguer stop hating and making everything into an argument!

[bectond]

There ya' go with all those If's again. I'll stand by EVERYTHING I've said about Apex in the past, present, and will say in the future. Why run multiple franchises and do a lousy job on each team when they could have put a maximum effort into one solid franchise?

Let's do some math, the CBA had 8 franchises start last season.

Two returning franchises Yakama and Albany. And two Trinity clubs Pittsburgh (I don't know who owns that club now) and the Alley Cats of Anderson.

By my count only four ownership groups total with Apex making up 50% of the league. (4 out of 8 clubs). Are you suggesting that the CBA could have survived with 4 teams and three ownership groups? Do you think Yakama would have played last year without Apex adding three clubs in Utah and Montana.

[Ken, Steelheads fan]

Let's do some math, the CBA had 8 franchises start last season.

Two returning franchises Yakama and Albany. And two Trinity clubs Pittsburgh (I don't know who owns that club now) and the Alley Cats of Anderson.

By my count only four ownership groups total with Apex making up 50% of the league. (4 out of 8 clubs). Are you suggesting that the CBA could have survived with 4 teams and three ownership groups? Do you think Yakama would have played last year without Apex adding three clubs in Utah and Montana.

Please do the math again:
Yakama, Albany, Pittsbugh, Anderson, and one solid Apex franchise (take your pick of the lousy franchises Apex ran/runs). That would have been five franchises. Plenty for a league.

Do I think Yakama would have played last year without Apex adding clubs in Utah and Montana? Of course I do. Yakama's decision to play is not based on travel distances. Their decision to play is based on whether the Yakama Tribal Council wants to continue to subsidize and operate yet another money losing operation.

On a somewhat unrelated note:
Those people thinking the Yakama Sun Kings would be a good fit for the D-League are not paying attention to the facts. It's only a matter of time before the Yakama Nation pulls the plug on this turkey.

[psbf]

who owns the Xplosion, I believe it's Freddy Lewis, who owned them originally.

As far as Yakama, from what I've been reading in the Herald-Republic, it looks like Ken is right. The Sun Kings were purchased by the tribe, but without the consent of their leaders. And the team is losing money.

[bomber29]

I can tell you for a fact that the new ownership group in minot is made up mostly non sponsors. A very, very small percentage is mad up of sponsors. They are mostly season ticket holders that really enjoy the games.

[kg21obf]

No one really knows how many $$$ the SKINGS are losing or if they even are. But to call them a turkey is interesting. What is the world is the rest of the league. You have to add about 5 teams attendance together to = the the Yakama squad.

[Ken, Steelheads fan]

I can tell you for a fact that the new ownership group in minot is made up mostly non sponsors. A very, very small percentage is mad up of sponsors. They are mostly season ticket holders that really enjoy the games.

Same deal. People protecting their investment in a team. Season tickets are an investment.

[Minor Leaguer]

Season tickets are an investment but normally nowhere near the level of a sponsor.

[Ken, Steelheads fan]

No one really knows how many $$$ the SKINGS are losing or if they even are. But to call them a turkey is interesting. What is the world is the rest of the league. You have to add about 5 teams attendance together to = the the Yakama squad.

Why compare Yakama to teams that can't draw flies? Shouldn't the gold standard be Sioux Falls over in the D-League? That team has been drawing large crowds on a consistent basis for years.

Oh, I thought you followed the plight of the Yakama Sun Kings. Maybe the following link will help. Of course, the Sun Kings lose money. It's not difficult to figure-out:
http://indiancountrynews.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1955&Itemid=33

[Ken, Steelheads fan]

Season tickets are an investment but normally nowhere near the level of a sponsor.

Hmmmmm. If that's true, then will someone PLEASE tell my wallet the good news. The ole leather guy just isn't getting the message. 8)

[kg21obf]

Thank you for that article. Anything from 11-7 -07 should be accurate today. My point is two fold, maybe they are not losing money this year with the solid following. And if they are, what are the other teams in the league doing.

[Sam Hill]

Let me ask this - if there is new ownership in Minot, can they please replace the broadcaster on the webcast? I mean, "Two points by a Patroon" just ain't going to cut it. And if you're going to announce the players, at least look at the notes - It's Jamaal Miller, not Milner, for god sakes! And if they're going to take a time out, could the broadcaster PUHLEEZE go over some statistics? And the town's name is ALL-Bany, not EHL-Bany. We don't pronounce the Skyrockets' home franchise as "Minnow," for example...

By the way, did she call Ray Cunningham a rookie?? Is this the same Ray Cunningham that not only played in the ABA two years ago, but in Minot last season??? Or is there a second Ray Cunningham out there that I don't know about?

And she's so amazed that the Skyrockets have little games in between time outs for the fans! God almighty!

If she was any good, she wouldn't be in Minot, North Dakota.

[Sam Hill]

Say this about Minot, their General Manager is quite fetching:

http://www.minotskyrockets.com/images/skyrockets/kim-mueller.jpg

[heavesrock]

It's official now: http://kxmc.com/video.asp?ArticleId=201581&VideoId=17026

[bectond]

Great news, now that guy from St. George needs to find 20 dudes from his town to pony up $5,000 each to buy the rights to the Utah Eagles and relocate them to Southern Utah. Then Apex can put all their resources into the Butte franchise. That way the Devils could hold a practice and get coached while doing so.

[MontanaFella]

Hopefully some of that money, if it comes, will help to make Great Falls sponsors like myself somewhat whole after all we have been through.

If you want to talk about good looking executives...go no futher than the man who is trying to kill the CBA.

http://www.greatfallsexplorers.com/explorers/frontoffice.html