CBA Playoffs?

[Minor Leaguer]

Has anybody heard how the CBA is going to conduct their playoffs this season? I know last year, it was switched at the very end and only the division winners made the playoffs. How many teams will qualify for the playoffs this season? I haven't read anything about this from the league.

[heavesrock]

I asked the same question a while back and was told that it was either the top 3 or top 4 teams in each division. I think you should email the league office.

[MinersFan3]

That would be nice to know . . .

[zeke41]

It's my understanding that the top 4 teams from each division qualify for the playoffs!

[Chuck the Writer]

It's my understanding that the top 4 teams from each division qualify for the playoffs!

So if that's the case, it'll be an 8-team bracket with #1 playing #4, and #2 playing #3 in each division, probably best of three.

The CBA Finals were best-of-five last year, that probably will remain the case.

[Minor Leaguer]

Chuck, I thought if anybody would know it would be you. Why in the heck would the CBA have 8 teams qualify for the playoffs? If that is the case, 80% of the teams would qualify for the postseason. What is the reason for even playing then regular season then?

[psbf]

It does seem senseless to have only two teams(of the whole league) elimated from the playoffs.

[Nubb16]

I guess you really don't have a lot of options with only 10 teams in the whole league. The next best you could do would be a 4 team playoff with the best 2 teams from each division being in the playoffs, but that would be less money and less excitement IMO.

[Chuck the Writer]

Chuck, I thought if anybody would know it would be you. Why in the heck would the CBA have 8 teams qualify for the playoffs? If that is the case, 80% of the teams would qualify for the postseason. What is the reason for even playing then regular season then?

Number one, I was only responding to the previous post. I didn't say that officially eight teams would make the playoffs - I only said that if there were eight teams in the playoffs, that would be the playoff format.

Number two, don't look at me like I draw a paycheck from the CBA. You want to find out the playoff structure, you call the league office yourself.

[MinersFan3]

How do they determine where playoff games will be played?

btw Chuck, thanks for your input. It really helps those of us who are new to the way the CBA does things. =()

Everyone has critics . . .

[psbf]

in fact, 4 teams in Each Division, the Xplosion will have to collect as many wins as possible, especially against teams like Oklahoma, since East Kentucky and Atlanta are winning(I mention them because they are closer to the even mark).

[Chuck the Writer]

How do they determine where playoff games will be played?

btw Chuck, thanks for your input. It really helps those of us who are new to the way the CBA does things. =()

Everyone has critics . . .

Most likely, as has been done in the past, the preliminary rounds will be a best-of-three, with game 1 at the lower-seeded team's venue, games 2 and 3 (if necessary) at the higher-seeded team's venue.

The best -of-five would be a 2-3 format, meaning the lower seed would host the first two games. Granted, this can all get turned around if there are scheduling conflicts with arenas.

[MinersFan3]

Thanks Chuck. Useful info . . .

[Pounder]

Do CBA players get paid for playing in the playoffs?

IIRC, I first learned from the ECHL that they don't pay players for playoff games. THEREFORE, there's a 16-team playoff with best-of-5s and a best-of-7 championship. Of course, ticket sales go DOWN from regular season gates, mostly because it's virtually impossible to make group sales for playoffs- groups usually require a lot of lead time, and playoff DATES are obviously not guaranteed on any schedule.

It's my thinking that, when a minor pro league (probably below AAA or the AHL, if you know what I mean) has lots of teams in the playoffs, players are probably playing at best at a discount (or maybe only for a winner's bonus), if not completely unpaid.

(Apologize for the tongue-twisters in this post)

[Chuck the Writer]

Chuck, I thought if anybody would know it would be you. Why in the heck would the CBA have 8 teams qualify for the playoffs? If that is the case, 80% of the teams would qualify for the postseason. What is the reason for even playing then regular season then?

After a while, I realized that in fact the league HAD put eight of ten teams in the playoffs in the past. In the 1966-67 season (back when the CBA was the EPBL), eight of the ten teams in the league at that time made the playoffs; the first round being a best-of-three series. The teams that were excused from the playoffs that year were the Harrisburg Patriots (10-17) and the Asbury Park Boardwalkers (2-26). The New Haven Elms, at 7-21, made the playoffs that year because they were in the same Eastern Division as Asbury Park, making them the fourth and final team to play in the postseason. Their postseason lasted only two games, they were swept by the eventual league champion Wilmington Blue Bombers in the first round.

In the 1968-69 season, the league was split into two five-team divisions, and the plan was to put the top four teams in each division in the playoffs. The only teams that did not make the playoffs that year were the Binghamton Flyers (9-18 ), and the woeful Springfield Hall of Famers (started the season 0-7, folded; all teams that had home games against the Famers received forfeit victories, expanding Springfield's final record to 0-18 ). None of the fourth-place teams that season advanced past the first round; both the Sunbury Mercuries (10-16) and the New Haven Elms (10-16) were swept in two straight games by the eventual EPBL finalists, Wilmington Blue Bombers and Wilkes-Barre Barons.

Then of course there's the 1999-2000 season (the Isiah year), where all nine of the CBA franchises that year made the playoffs, which at that time were a single-elimination "one and done" bracket tournament.

Of course, a lot of factors go into minor league playoff bracketology - travel costs, arena availability, number of teams in the league, franchise stability, and whatnot. Sometimes the league will have an odd number of franchises make the playoffs, with higher-seeded teams receiving first-round byes (which has happened several times in the 1960's and 1970's).

[panchess]

.. I am sure Chuck meant an odd number of teams in a division, not the whole league.

For example, the Canadian Footballl League has six teams in two divisions make the playoffs, so three in each division normally qualify. The second place team plays the third place team in the first round, with the winner playing the division champion the next week. The two teams coming out of the divisional playoff play in the Grey Cup.

[Minor Leaguer]

Chuck, you told me a lot about the history of the CBA playoffs but you never answered my question. If a league is going to allow 80% of its teams into the postseason, what is the point of even playing a regular season?

[Chuck the Writer]

Chuck, you told me a lot about the history of the CBA playoffs but you never answered my question. If a league is going to allow 80% of its teams into the postseason, what is the point of even playing a regular season?

That's a "leading the witness" question. In fact, you're still under the assumption that I originally said that the league would let eight of ten teams in the playoffs this season, which I didn't. I said that IF they were going to do that (in response to another person's post), then the playoffs would be most likely set up in that format.

In fact, why don't you go ask the NHL the same question, because I recall when they used to let 16 of 21 franchises in the playoffs every year - essentially spending all season eliminating the Winnipeg Jets from the playoffs.

[Minor Leaguer]

Well obviously the NHL has learned since it no longer has that high of a percentage of their teams playing in the postseason. Also, don't try and compare a professional team to a minor league team. That is like comparing apples and oranges. You know as well as I do that it is much more common for a professional team to make money than a minor league team.

[Chuck the Writer]

.. I am sure Chuck meant an odd number of teams in a division, not the whole league.

Oh no, I meant that an odd number of teams make the playoffs. That's when first-round byes come into play.

Example - 1978-79 season, eight teams in the league (well, seven finished the season after the Baltimore Metros franchise folded, relocated to NY as the Mohawk Valley Thunderbirds and folded again). Five teams made the playoffs - with the #4 and #5 seeds (Allentown and Jersey Shore) playing a best-of-three while the other three teams waited. Then, with four teams left in the playoffs, a regular Shaughnessy playoff format commenced (#1 v. #4, #2 v. #3).

Then in 1985-86, nine teams made the playoffs based on a technicality. The #2 seed Evansville Thunder were expelled from the CBA for failure to pay league dues, so the #1 seed in the Western Division (Cincinnati Slammers) played what was essentially the #5 seed in the Western Division (Kansas City Sizzlers, the forefather of the Yakama Sun Kings). Cincinnati eliminated KC in a first-round best-of-seven in four straight games - then had to play Evansville in a hastily-arranged best-of-five series, as the Thunder suddenly come up with funds to get reinstated into the league (thank God the team moved to Quad City where things were more stable). So essentially Cincinnati had to play two first-round playoff series that year.

[Chuck the Writer]

Don't try and compare a professional team to a minor league team. That is like comparing apples and oranges. You know as well as I do that it is much more common for a professional team to make money than a minor league team.

Same thing happened in the American Hockey League (a minor league, unless something happened to the AHL that I don't know about).

Back when I was covering the AHL and other minor leagues for Hockey Ink! magazine, I know that 12 teams out of 16 made the playoffs in the 1990's - for example, the 1992-93, 1993-94 and 1994-95 season (the teams played until there were only three teams left, then the #2 and #3 seeds would play a best-of series to face the #1 seed). I especially recall this as I had to drive 12 hours to Fredericton NB for Game 4 of the Calder Cup finals, Fredericton Canadiens v. Albany River Rats, played in this tiny 3000 seat arena on the University of New Brunswick campus.

Oh, and for future use, don't mix your terminology. You either meant "major league" versus "minor league", or "professional" versus "amateur."

Wanna try again??

[Minor Leaguer]

Chuck- Alright English Professor. Just because a couple hockey leagues have done it in the past, that gives you reason to justify the CBA for potentially doing the same thing? Two wrongs don't make a right big guy!

[Chuck the Writer]

Chuck- Alright English Professor. Just because a couple hockey leagues have done it in the past, that gives you reason to justify the CBA for potentially doing the same thing? Two wrongs don't make a right big guy!

Again, I'm not justifying anything.

Again, you're making a mistake in assumption.

For the third time, I only postulated a scenario that if the CBA were to put eight teams in the playoffs, that a playoff bracket would be set up in such a way. You jumped on that and assumed that a 2008 8-team CBA playoff was set in stone, and are chastising me regarding same.

And after I proved to you that it has happened in other minor league sports, you go with the "two wrongs don't make it right" blast.

No, two wrongs don't make a right. But two Wrights make an airplane.

Or is it three rights make a left?

You want more?

8 out of 12 teams in 1992 made the Arena Football playoffs.
8 out of 10 teams in 1993 made the Arena Football playoffs.
6 out of 8 teams in 2000 made the International Basketball League playoffs.

So it's happened in minor and major leagues, in several different sports. If you have a problem with how the playoffs are set up, go contact the CBA or whatever league irritates you the most and address it with them.

[Minor Leaguer]

You still seem to be saying that you think the idea of 80% of the league making the playoffs in any league is correct. Again we don't know if that is indeed the case this year in the CBA, but if it is I believe that is not the right way to conduct playoffs. You can go ahead and give all your examples of different leagues that have done this in the past. So let me ask you this then Chuck: Do you believe a league should let 80% of its teams make the playoffs? Let's face it, it's not like the majority of the teams are going to be making additional money by them hosting home playoff games. What other justification can you possibly give that would make sense? Oh and no your examples of other leagues don't count as a justification.

[Chuck the Writer]

You still seem to be saying that you think the idea of 80% of the league making the playoffs in any league is correct. Again we don't know if that is indeed the case this year in the CBA, but if it is I believe that is not the right way to conduct playoffs. You can go ahead and give all your examples of different leagues that have done this in the past. So let me ask you this then Chuck: Do you believe a league should let 80% of its teams make the playoffs? Let's face it, it's not like the majority of the teams are going to be making additional money by them hosting home playoff games. What other justification can you possibly give that would make sense? Oh and no your examples of other leagues don't count as a justification.

You still seem to be mis-reading whatever I post. For the fourth time, I never said that 80% of the teams making the playoffs is correct, incorrect or otherwise. I just said that it happened in the past. Nothing more, nothing less. That's not an opinion, it's fact. Last year only two teams made the playoffs in the CBA. The year before, six out of eight did. The year before that, four out of eight. Do I know why the league only let Albany and Yakama participate in the playoffs? No. Do I know why the year before all six teams participated in a round-robin with the top two teams advancing based on quarterpoints in the round-robin? No. I don't sit in on CBA league meetings, so I don't know what the machinations are when it comes to the reasons behind playoff settings.

Second, I'm getting really tired of you cross-examining me on these posts about what the CBA's doing for playoffs and what Albany's uniforms look like and whatnot. As I said before, if you got a problem with the way the CBA is run, contact Dennis Truax, the CBA Deputy Commissioner, or contact Jim Coyne, the CBA Acting Commissioner, or Ben Fernandez, the Chairman of the Board of Directors. Don't get on my case because of things you don't like about the league.

And as for your opinion as to how many teams belong in the playoffs in any given year - I do have an opinion on how many teams should participate in any postseason. But I'm not going to tell you, because first of all you've already made up your opinion about how many teams YOU feel should be in the playoffs.

All I know is that whoever does make the playoffs this season will make for a very interesting postseason bracket. Will Yakama three-peat? Will Albany avenge their loss from last season? Will Chris Daleo finally get that ring? Can the championship return to Montana for the first time since the early 1980's? Could the championship return to Pennsylvania for the first time since 1995? Will any - or all - or only a few of those franchises play at the end of March?

Guess time will tell, won't it?

[Minor Leaguer]

Chuck says he is taking his ball and going home. Just because I have an opinion about how many teams should be in the playoffs doesn't make it right. Therefore I asked for your opinion, but you seem to think that you are too important to have to tell anybody. All I know is that whoever does make the playoffs this season will make for a very interesting postseason bracket. Will Yakama three-peat? I would say that as long as Woolpert is the coach there, they have a very great chance. Will Albany avenge their loss from last season? Well if the league decides to do like they did last year, then Albany wouldn't even be making the playoffs if the season ended today. Will Chris Daleo finally get that ring? It is possible as he always seems to bring in veterans who know what it takes to win. Can the championship return to Montana for the first time since the early 1980's? There is a better chance of pigs flying. Could the championship return to Pennsylvania for the first time since 1995? Not gonna happen.

[Chuck the Writer]

Chuck says he is taking his ball and going home. Just because I have an opinion about how many teams should be in the playoffs doesn't make it right. Therefore I asked for your opinion, but you seem to think that you are too important to have to tell anybody.

Now see, there you go again. Nowhere did I say I was taking any ball and going home. Yeah, I know it's a figure of speech. All I said was that I didn't appreciate being attacked for issues involving the CBA, and I certainly don't appreciate having words put in my mouth regarding whether I feel it's acceptable or unacceptable to have that number of teams in the playoffs. It's not one of those "you're entitled to your opinion, unless you disagree with me, in which case you're wrong and dumb."

Obviously you are a Sun Kings fan or at least appreciate the Sun Kings; and perhaps you live in Yakama or the surrounding area. Perhaps we can settle these issues during the All-Star Classic; I'll be at the SunDome for the games. So if you do live in the area, perhaps we can break bread and talk face to face.

[Minor Leaguer]

As a matter of fact, I don't live in Yakama or even Washington for that matter. I just am very familiar with the CBA and look at things from a realistic standpoint. With that being said, it seems as though up to this point the Sun Kings are far superior to the rest of the league. Like you said I do appreciate the Sun Kings because I think they are a solidly run franchise.

[Chuck the Writer]

The 2007-2008 CBA Media Guide states that four teams - two from each conference - will qualify for the playoffs, based on quarter-points earned during the regular season. As an example, if the season were to end today, that would mean Minot would play Albany in a best-of-three (game 1 at Albany, game 2 and 3 at Minot), while Yakama would play Butte (Game 1 at Butte, Games 2 and 3 at Yakama). The winners of both series would face each other in a best-of-three series for the Ramsdell Trophy (game 1 at lower seed, games 2 and 3 at higher seed).

Now this could change by the time the playoffs actually hit, but it looks like according to the media guide, only four out of the ten teams in the league would go to the playoffs. Four from the entire league, not four from each conference.

[cat1bb1]

1. For all your professionalism.

2. For always providing and following through until answers are found.

3. For not losing your cool when people try to push it.

It is appreciated!

[panchess]

It would be an interesting thing to have available.

I watched the Patroons-Miners game online last night. Pretty good quality.

[Chuck the Writer]

It would be an interesting thing to have available.

I watched the Patroons-Miners game online last night. Pretty good quality.

Contact the CBA if you want to purchase this year's media guide.

I followed the stats on my BlackBerry; I was down at the Lionheart Pub on Madison Avenue taking pictures of the Emeralds, they were part of a charity fundraiser to gather money and clothes for a children's orphanage. Fun stuff.