Crash and Burn

[Bakersfield Scream]

Why do I get the feeling that watching the ABA and all that has gone on is like watching two 747's headed right toward each other, on a crash and burn mission. Let's see venue problems, tryout problems............teams from coast to coast............Oh this should be fun to watch.

[South Atlantic]

I guess you can be happy since your team won't start until next season!

By then, the Bakersfield team officials will be able to sit back and watch it crash or elevate.

And after reading that article in regards to the Native American team. When Ledesma says he doesnt care what the potential players think, why does he have anything to do with this league? I read where Joe said that he would pull the team from the league if he found wrongdoing, but he needs to look into his teams ownership groups a little closer to avoid having these black eyes on his league.

[skippy]

The ABA should be interesting to watch from afar this year.
How many teams actually have confirmed venues, coaches, etc?

The regional idea is brilliant, however I don't believe the ABA will be the one carry it out to it's fruition.

Also, how does Ledesma plan on fielding a team if he is relying on sponsorship dollars to have tryouts?

You can't run a team based on projected income.
{see WBL, and SWBL, for good examples on this type of "magical thinking"}

[Ken, Steelheads fan]

I've only heard words of reason come out of the ABA on two occasions:

1) Bakersfield, when David Higdon (head of Bakersfield's management group) said he was going to wait and see how the league developed before committing a large sum of money.

2) Long Beach, early this year when the owner expressed his concerns about expansion going on without current ownership groups being consulted.

...and that's it. The talk of new arenas being built, teams restricted to one race of Americans, selling out 18,000 seat venues, almost all news coming out of the Atlanta area, etc. is hogwash!

[Houston Caldwell]

Our Nashville ABA franchise is blessed with the stewardship of high-quality young people who put a great value on credibility in Dan Bucher, Ashley Mac, and Sally Anthony. I can see we're going to need these qualities in spades.
Ken, if you communicated with Dan Bucher as often as I do, you would be stunned at how often the two of you agree.
The latest release about a second Atlanta-area franchise is just plumb loco. The ECHL (where my company is a licensee) has two teams (Fresno and Bakersfield) with the same management, and are, in my opinion, a highly credible league, but the mention of Coach Brian Couso in the Atlanta release appalled me. IS BRIAN COUSO GOING TO COACH BOTH TEAMS?
Also, the Tampa Bay (2005) release had aspects that bother me; Tracy Carr is described as an Atlanta lawyer, but, when I checked with the Atlanta-area Bar Association, they didn't show anyone by the name of Tracy Carr as a member of the Bar IN THE ENTIRE STATE OF GEORGIA.
Some indefensible BS is going on here, and I don't want the smell of it to stick to people that I, through experience, have come to believe in and trust.

[CRUSADERSFAN]

Our Nashville ABA franchise is blessed with the stewardship of high-quality young people who put a great value on credibility in Dan Bucher, Ashley Mac, and Sally Anthony. I can see we're going to need these qualities in spades.
Ken, if you communicated with Dan Bucher as often as I do, you would be stunned at how often the two of you agree.
The latest release about a second Atlanta-area franchise is just plumb loco. The ECHL (where my company is a licensee) has two teams (Fresno and Bakersfield) with the same management, and are, in my opinion, a highly credible league, but the mention of Coach Brian Couso in the Atlanta release appalled me. IS BRIAN COUSO GOING TO COACH BOTH TEAMS?
Also, the Tampa Bay (2005) release had aspects that bother me; Tracy Carr is described as an Atlanta lawyer, but, when I checked with the Atlanta-area Bar Association, they didn't show anyone by the name of Tracy Carr as a member of the Bar IN THE ENTIRE STATE OF GEORGIA.
Some indefensible BS is going on here, and I don't want the smell of it to stick to people that I, through experience, have come to believe in and trust.

houston-
I completely agree with you. My personal belief is that most teams are ready to go. However, I believe Joe Newman is selling teams to people who either won't put money into the teams, or don't have the money to put into them. Part of his problem has been allowing people to have teams, I wish he'd rule with an Iron Fist. If he doesn't start now, it will be too late to save the ABA, his dream, from destruction :roll:

[South Atlantic]

There needs to be a plan for Joe to sift through the good and bad ownership groups. Here are my problems.

1. Owners who currently dont live in the same state or never have resided in the city they put a team in should be put on the back burner. Many minor league franchises (hockey and baseball included) have local roots owners who the communities know and feel comfortable with. They are the owners most likely to give back and want to give back, not just for PR moves.

2. Owners who talk about making a profit after year one, need to be discarded with all other non-realistic people. Not just in this league but almost any league, your first 2-3 years should be viewed as a loss. You need to be establishing yourself in the community. Building support, fan base, sponsorship monies, etc need to be done the first few seasons.

3. If the only money you put into the team is the franchise fee, get it back. That wont be enough to do anything. Even after running numerous free agent camps, that wont cover your salary cap. Plus, the money from the camp is not yours personally, it belongs to the teams operations. Period. You shouldnt try to justify why you are paying the staff or yourself half of the camp money.

4. If an owner says they have a venue, see the contract. If no contract, no team awarded to the area. And if they tell you how they plan on building a venue for their team, send them to the ward with the other loonies. Especially if they arent from that area or state!

Here would be my checklist for potential ownership groups of ABA teams.

1. Establish Ownership Group
2. Identify start up funds and working capital
3. Meet with city officials to discuss plan and potential support,
4. Line up venue - including training camp, tryouts, summer camps, etc.
5. Apply for ABA franchise when venue is cleared.
6. Find franchise staff
7. Sign 2-3 local players to create excitement
8. Introduce team to the city - Meet the staff night
9. Have 2 tryout camps within your state at least!
10. Begin training camp and thus your season.

[meyes]

I completely agree with the three preceeding posts.

[Tha Man*]

South Atlantic -

I also agree to about 99% of what you said.

[South Atlantic]

Just for the sake of knowing, what 1% did you disagree with me on? Maybe I overlooked something.

Does anyone know for a fact which teams have venues? Which teams have well, teams? Not much out of four or five teams listed but that doesnt always mean the obvious.

To answer a previous post, I do know the Motown Jammers have a team and are properly funded. They will play their games at the U-M Dearborn Campus and rumor has it from school administration, they are actually purchasing flooring (with ABA logos, team logos, etc) to be put down for the season.

[meyes]

South Atlantic,
Thanks for the info about the Jammers. Here are the teams that I know have arenas (according to their web sites or other sources).
Nashville, Kentucky, Cincinnati, Kansas City, Maryland, Fresno, Long Beach, Boston, Jacksonville, Gwinnett, Portland, Fort Worth, Mississippi. I am sure there are others I don't know about.

[skippy]

These are the teams that concern me {the most} as not going to happen.


Harlem {haven't named the team yet}
Native America {no venue, no tryouts, not paying the staff, not removing people from website who ask not to be associated anymore...SCAM!}
Vancouver {Announcing Jim Harrick as coach, only to have him deny it days later}
Reno {I have heard literally nothing about them}
Fort Worth {igotdmoney@aol.com is the contact address?}
All the california teams {late starting weird location
Colorado Springs {Lack of funding, possibly, The probably have the best GM ever in the history of the league}
Calgary {bad, bad, bad, place for sports in general}

[Houston Caldwell]

To my friend South Atlantic;
Agree with most points.
In Nashville, both Sally Anthony(owner) and Dan Bucher (GM) are actually native Hoosiers from Indiana. Here's where they went right.
In hiring Ashley Mac as HC, they not only created an instant news story, they also locked in the support of the close-knit Vanderbilt community.This is invaluable in local basketball. Coach Flatt, the first assistant, is probably related to the Lipscomb University President, no doubt helping with the lining up of an ideal venue in Allen Arena, plus the support of Nashville's large Church of Christ community (the Flatts are an athletic bunch; one of them is now a scholarship QB at Ole Miss). Charles Anderson is a legendary local HS and Junior College coach; the franchise's first 4 player signings all either played HS or College ball in Nashville (Adam Sonn played at Belmont, sealing in the fans at the OTHER end of Belmont Boulevard). The bottom line is that the out-of-towners in charge cultivated all the right friends to succeed locally, and THEY LISTEN TO THEM. So it IS possible for out-of-towners to succeed with a local franchise, but they need to get the right local people involved, and pay careful attention to their input.

[ABARedWhiteBlue]

New Jersey has their arena as well; it will be completed within the month at Ramapo Colege.

[CRUSADERSFAN]

These are the teams that concern me {the most} as not going to happen.


Harlem {haven't named the team yet}
Native America {no venue, no tryouts, not paying the staff, not removing people from website who ask not to be associated anymore...SCAM!}
Vancouver {Announcing Jim Harrick as coach, only to have him deny it days later}
Reno {I have heard literally nothing about them}
Fort Worth {igotdmoney@aol.com is the contact address?}
All the california teams {late starting weird location
Colorado Springs {Lack of funding, possibly, The probably have the best GM ever in the history of the league}
Calgary {bad, bad, bad, place for sports in general}

Sorry, Colorado Springs has the "Vancouver Syndrome" ,announcing stuff that didn't happen.

[skippy]

What did Colorado Springs announce that didn't happen?
Goughan as the GM?
He would be the only reason they could succeed.

[CRUSADERSFAN]

http://abalive.com/news/releases/20040816c.html

[patmc16]

To answer a previous post, I do know the Motown Jammers have a team and are properly funded. They will play their games at the U-M Dearborn Campus and rumor has it from school administration, they are actually purchasing flooring (with ABA logos, team logos, etc) to be put down for the season.

If no one comes to see them play because no one knows they exist, does any of that matter? No website, no advertising, no media coverage, no tryouts announced, no announced roster or coaching staff, no way to find out anything about the team.

Pardon me if I'm skeptical but it all seems like the basketball equivalent of the IIHL disaster that the Great Lakes region just went through last winter. I was all ready to support that league with my "fan dollars". There was never even a location announced to buy tickets. I went by the Detroit team's arena at the fair grounds on their opening day, only to find it looking like you might expect the fair grounds to look in the middle of winter.... deserted. I guess I'll take the wait and see approach. No sense getting excited by what to this point looks like nothing.

What happens if they buy a floor with logos and then change it for the fourth time? :roll:

[skippy]

Good, Good. Way to go ABA

Thanks for the info...obviously, that wasn't a press release that the ABA would trumpet, so that's how I missed it.

Damn, Goughan knew what he was doing.....that's probably why he's not involved.