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One of many
07-12-2007, 04:39 PM
Can someone tell me what is really going on in LB? Ashley quit? Phil fired?
Steve Bash did what? Has Jay gone bonkers yet? Are the GBL paying their debts? Ed Hart thought he had the only soap opera with Desparate Housewives. Wrong.
So many people have had keys to the Armada deluxe trailer that they shouldn't bother to lock the doors. The last employee on the payroll, please turn out the lights.
I look forward to the spin on this one.

preeths
07-12-2007, 04:52 PM
There is a lot of turnover in the front offices of minor and independent league baseball. No spin. Get used to it.

RW22
07-12-2007, 05:14 PM
Are you administartor or spokesman for the GBL?

The long beach situation is worse than peple know. The first GM quit this year, and as quoted in the Press-Telegram "the GBL is not paying my vendors" and "i cannot do business the way they do business". That was the first clue as to a temultuous season headed our way. Instead up giving the GM job to the Asst GM, they brought in the current president. He is the one that killed another minor league franchise in town, just a few months earlier. The GBL said in their press release that he was a "marketing genius" and thats why they brought him on board. He managed to bring over about 80% of his hockey staff with him. OK, he defaults on his lease with the Arena, what makes anyone think he can sell any more tickets or run an office any better across town. The comments you see here are a REFLECTION of the way the fans see the game on game day; and the teams response or lack of to our concerns.

As a GENERAL note, there was a post removed regarding alcohol use by staff memebers. As a FACT, the hockey club was remanded after only ONE WEEK by the league office for alcohol related offenses within and around the arena. The hockey offices are completly across the country, so what was going on, travelled 3000 miles to be reported. I do not fault you for removing that post, it was directed at one person and should have gone to the Commish directly.

Turnover in minor league sports is high, I will grant you that. In most leagues however, the turnover is from good employess finding better opportunities. That is not what is happening in Long Beach, they are firing competent people because they are frustrated and voicing their opinions as such. This is the same MO as what happened at the hockey clubs offices. No one wanted to work, and the product sufferred. We have seen this act before in this town, and a lot of the season ticket holders are crossover fans. It is obvious by the number of posts regarding Long Beach, that there reallly may be a problem.

Maybe not as bad as it comes off, but passionate baseball fans will try and help their teams out as much as we can. It is when management doffs a deaf ear that things get frustrating and the ill will starts. With all being said here about Long Beach, I am truely suprised that no one from the team, or the GBL has stepped in to say "boo". So, we are left to fetter our own thoughts, and have no recouse but to let our frustrations out here.

I see nothing wrong with trying to fix a problem that we all see, a problem that we hear about when we go to the park from other fans. Most fans dont even know this site exists. I know we are probably one of the most viewed/posted areas here. It validates the concern that we have for this league and the teams that we root for --and against!

Maybe if the GBL would sit down and look at some of these complaints, and address them, we could all get back to talking baseball. Until they come out from behind the desk, we'll still be pounding away--just trying to make things right on our local levels.

Is there anything wrong with asking that much??

RW

preeths
07-12-2007, 05:26 PM
I'm admin of this board. There is nothing wrong with desiring continued improvement. There is something wrong with an agenda that attempts to paint an inaccurate picture.

RW22
07-12-2007, 05:38 PM
First, I did not mean to come off that crass to you..my bad.

Second, we cannot even start to scratch the surface of what really goes on in the Long Beach offices. Posting rules and privacy issues just would not allow us to. If you really think this is an off base and over used topic--I would be happy to send you my cell phone number and let you know the basis for the fodder. I have been around this league for three years, and these people are not wrong about their insights. The lack of response from the GBL is was is really fueling the fires. Until they do give these people answears, the same questions and frustrations exist. Which is why we use this platform to help us deal with a league that doesnt care about their most passionate fans...it keeps the fans from going nuts.
I applaud them for trying to help a league out, we all have ideas-all cant be met. But we do have minimum expectations for how our teams are run, represenated and their responsabilities to our communities. If we have a problem with any of those issues, the league is responsible for anwearing those questions in a timely manner.

peeaanuut
07-12-2007, 05:50 PM
I totally agree that an agenda that paints an innacurate picture is wrong, but that is not what is happening here. The things being reported:

-Alcohol Use and Abuse during games
-Power Trip Firings
-Failure to keep promises to sponsors
-Failure to keep promises to fans and vendors
-Humiliation of Employees in front of fans
-Lack of attendance to the game by the one person that should be at every game
-Unpaid employees
-Unpaid Vendors
-Mental Harrassment of Employees in private and public
-Threatening employees future in organized professional sports and taking action against their future in organized professional sports.
-Complete failure to improve or even maintain the team
-Theft of copyrighted material

These are just the tip of the iceburg. I am certain there are other things that even those of us close to the front office are unaware of. Which I wont even speculate about. I have first hand knowledge of all of those issues listed.

One of many
07-12-2007, 05:50 PM
Preeths? What is your agenda?
It's a fair question? No agenda here. It's odd that for administrating the site, you seem very defensive. Turnover in minor league baseball is common in the fall, not May, June and July.

One of many
07-12-2007, 05:54 PM
Wow. You ask a question and you get an answer. Thanks, Peenut.
Now, I would expect your answer to disappear into the GBL vault of silence.

preeths
07-12-2007, 06:11 PM
Preeths? What is your agenda?
It's a fair question? No agenda here. It's odd that for administrating the site, you seem very defensive. Turnover in minor league baseball is common in the fall, not May, June and July.

My agenda is accuracy. Welcome to my site.

RW22
07-12-2007, 06:13 PM
You ususally do not get this explosive of an answear. Just thoughts and amusements. You just happen to hit a hot button topic in Southern California. The admin is ususally a pretty quiet guy who lets us speak our mind. Im not sure if he has been contacted by the GBL to "tone us down", as he was to be sending a "retracted posting" down. Pure speculation, and no malice intended...it just seems funny that that article got pulled, sent to the GBL commisioner and then he pops in with an opinion.
I do agree 100% that the posting, in its format, should have been pulled. Im just not sure why he decided to pop in on this question. Its not a dead issue until people stop responding to it....we have had a ton of hits and responses regarding this and other issues. I would think that helps his bottom line--why jump in on what is still a very hot and volatile topic. As long as we are clear as to our gripes and do not single individuals out, I see no reason to stop the conversation from continuing.
If Long Beach folds (I have no idea what the GBL plans are), and we stood idle, I would blame the citizens and fans of that team. What we are doing is trying to let the league know what we feel locally, and maybe get them to see a defecientcy that they cant see from 800 miles up the road. When the Commisseor of the ECHL came to town, the front office sent out an email to ALL employees asking them to be on their best behavior because he was coming in. Why is that even necessary to do, if you have control over your employees? Someone try and explain that to me...or not

preeths
07-12-2007, 06:21 PM
As you mentioned, and agreed with, the original posting is the reason I'm keeping an eye on things closer. No conspiracy. This is a private business that does not take marching orders from any league. No one is trying to stop conversation. I find it odd that anyone interpreted it that way.

RW22
07-12-2007, 06:40 PM
Nope, I was hoping for that response, thank you!!!
Timing is everything, it just seemed like a reaction by you to stop a new thread about an old subject when you were to be in contact with the Commish. Thats all, we all seem to cross the line with passion at times--and what you are seeing in this thread against this particular team is not a witch hunt at all. It is people frustrated with what they see every night at the ballpark. The GBL will come down on occassion, but everyone knows when they are here and is on their best behaviour. If that were to happen every day, we'd be shouting about LaRue getting picked up by the Angels!
No harm, no foul with me....

RW

Pounder
07-12-2007, 06:45 PM
General rule: when you see personal accusations, expect a phone call and a pullback from whatever "free speech" you were expecting. Not the first time I've seen this, and I understand where preeths is "potentially" coming from. Nobody likes lawsuits, after all.

Moreover, "going personal" gives the POTENTIAL of giving sympathy to your target. If the target deserves no such slack, you're better off keeping the analysis to issues of team operations and the like.

peeaanuut
07-12-2007, 06:58 PM
I understand the private website/lack of free speech laws fully on msg boards on the internet. I have dealt with and ran many msg boards in my time.

There is a specific difference between saying someone is doing something illegal and reporting a behavior that is not in step with a persons positions.

Had I said I saw someone rape someone, I understand that being pulled as that is speculation and very damaging.

But if I said, I saw 2 adults of consenting age sharing a pasionate kiss, I would not expect that to be pulled.

The 2 things that I reported and I am certain is the reason the post was pulled were not illegal acts. Drinking is not illegal and 2 consenting adults touching each other sexually is not illegal.

I simply do not see in this case why the post was pulled. But it is your site and you can do what you please. I do not think you take "marching orders" from the league and any league officials are your guests as much as any of us are. However I think that since you are not directly involved with the league as a fan, player, coach or staff, you assuming something is false is a bad judgement call.

Just my thoughts.

DCNationals
07-12-2007, 08:43 PM
What does a GBL GM get paid??? It can't be much. This Bash situation, of which I will happily admit I know nothing about, may just be a case of "getting what you pay for". Sometimes it is better to pay more upfront and get a better class of people.

I do know that if I was "verbally abused" in front of fans by my boss, he would get his teeth knocked out. No job so important as to put up with that, least of all what is probably a near minimum wage position.

preeths
07-13-2007, 11:01 AM
Nope, I was hoping for that response, thank you!!!
Timing is everything, it just seemed like a reaction by you to stop a new thread about an old subject when you were to be in contact with the Commish. Thats all, we all seem to cross the line with passion at times--and what you are seeing in this thread against this particular team is not a witch hunt at all. It is people frustrated with what they see every night at the ballpark. The GBL will come down on occassion, but everyone knows when they are here and is on their best behaviour. If that were to happen every day, we'd be shouting about LaRue getting picked up by the Angels!
No harm, no foul with me....

RW

The timing is as simple as this: I saw a new thread with a title that piqued my curiosity. Upon reading the first post, I decided, as you did, that it stepped over the line. I removed it, which you agreed was the proper move, and rather than burying it, I explained why it was taken down and emailed the message over to Mr. Outcalt so he could look into it further. Lest you misinterpret, that was my first "contact" with the commish in weeks.

preeths
07-13-2007, 11:03 AM
Peeaanuut, please check your PMs.

RW22
07-13-2007, 12:55 PM
Good enough for me....thanks for the re-explaination (is that a word??)

GBLCommish
07-15-2007, 01:42 PM
Hi Baseballkid3,

I'll answer all baseball-related questions that I can, and most business related questions, but can't discuss any specific employee or personnel issues.

We do have many employees that have worked in the league, at the team level, a second or third time. Either because their job was seasonal or an opening occured that they were better suited for after not succeeding (for whatever reason) in a previous position.

I will be glad to talk to you in private regarding your interests in employment. Just give me a call on Monday at 925-226-2896.

Best Regards,
Kevin Outcalt
Commissioner
Golden Baseball League
commish@goldenbaseball.com

RW22
07-15-2007, 02:55 PM
Thanks for the response to the Kid3. I know that you do not talk about specifics when it comes to employment here, goodness knows I wouldnt want my performance reviewe online everyday. However, with 19 posts and 300 views-I think the "bigger" picture was missed.
There are a few threads going now about the substandard operations (both front office and game day) in Long Beach. Will you at least acknowledge that there are problems and let us know that you and others are working on it? There seems to be a bit of a "mob mentality" going, and with no replies, it just seems to be rolling right along.
I get asked questions at games from people who do not use/know of this meseege board. The only answear I will give them when they ask is "I havent heard anything".
So, if you could give us even a vague update as to what is happening, we would appreciate it!
Thanks
RW

GBLCommish
07-15-2007, 04:07 PM
Hello RW22,

Certainly we have issues that we need to resolve in Long Beach and in all of our markets. This league, like all independents, is about continuosly working on improving -- players, coaching staff, umpires, game day, front office, and league officials too.

I don't think it's about as much as "mob mentality" as you mention, but more that we have very passionate fans that are connected closely to their teams and feel it is important to communicate their perspective -- even though realizing that it may be narrow or anecdotal as they aren't involved in day-to-day operations of the team but they care enough to speak up when they are concerned.

As for Long Beach, having to change leadership so close to the start of the season has resulted in a tumultuous time, with lots of issues and problems that need to be solved and improved. Dave Kaval, league CEO, handles the business side of the company and has been down to Long Beach many times since the leadership change and is communicating with a number of the fans on this board that have reached out to him directly. However, the team is not only performing very strongly on the field, but as a business with an excellent relationship with the city of Long Beach.

Although I deal with the baseball-related issues of the league, I'll talk to anyone who has an opinion or suggestion to help us get better. Joe Kling, Peeanut on this board, has exchanged emails and plans to call in a couple of days, but I'd love to have a discussion with you as well. Please give me a call on Monday, or anyday that is good for you next week as I appreciate your interest to help and support the team and the league.. You can reach me in the office at 925-226-2896.

Best Regards,
Kevin Outcalt
Commissioner
Golden Baseball League
commish@goldenbaseball.com

RW22
07-15-2007, 05:15 PM
Thank you Commish for the invite. I will do that!
RW