PDA

View Full Version : Steubenville may fold


Fran
05-07-2007, 11:39 PM
Stampede may be done

By MIKE MATHISON, Sports editor



STEUBENVILLE — The Steubenville Stampede may be done.

What started out as a promising season may end short of completion.

Owner Ramone Davenport is in financial difficulty and is actively shopping the organization to a new owner or new investors.

“It’s kind of hard to run an operation when there’s no support,” Davenport said. “I know in other cities, there is a need for indoor football and it draws well.

“In comparison to other cities, I need to see if it’s just Steubenville or the league (Continental Indoor Football League) in general.

“Coming in I knew it was an uphill battle, but, I didn’t know it would be that difficult. I’m an ego-driven person and I think I can do everything. I got into a situation where some things happened last year and I thought I could overcome them where people would see a new owner, a new team, a new league and people would flock to it if done correctly.

“The intentions and the effort is there. In actuality, I’m not getting the support for whatever the reason. Only the fans know the truth of why they are not coming out and supporting it.

“It’s hard for me to stay in business if I’m only getting 100 fans per game. If I’m only getting x-amount of people each game, I can’t stay in business that long.”

The players have not been paid in almost a month.

The Stampede, who started 4-0, are now 4-2 and the morale is as terrible as the fan support. It appeared there were more people in the stands at Vaccaro Field to watch Catholic Central and Toronto battle than in the stands at St. John Arena to watch Steubenville and New England battle.

“That’s what’s killing us,” said Stampede head coach Demetrius Ross. “It’s not the on-the-field stuff that’s killing us, it’s the off-the-field stuff that we can’t control like lack of support, lack of financial stability, bad ownership. It’s just pulling this team apart.

“How can I ask my guys to go out here and give me the effort that it’s going to take to win us a championship and to be successful on the field when we can’t practice. We don’t have trainers. We can’t practice because guys are scared of getting hurt and guys can’t get to practice because they haven’t been paid in four weeks and they have no money to put in the gas tank.

“I’ve got local guys that can’t eat. I’m begging restaurants to allow my players to eat. I don’t know what more I can ask from them. They’re giving me everything they got under the circumstances.

“And, this community, along with the ownership, is just killing this team. And, it’s a shame because we are a good team. We are truly a good team.

“And, we’ve been hit with adversity off the field and, finally, it’s caught up to us on the field.

“It’s not us. It’s nothing that we’re doing.”

Davenport admits the players have not been paid.

“There is some back pay that needs to be paid,” he said. “Just based on five home games we’ve had, we haven’t hit 1,500 people in five home games combined. That’s probably a record right there.

“It is rough for me right now to stay afloat. I’ve spoken with other investors within the city and hopefully somebody steps up and wants to invest in this thing to keep this thing in Steubenville.

“Right now is extremely difficult for myself. You can be a millionaire and come into a situation with a lack of sponsorship dollars from the start, and not getting fan support on top of that, how can you survive like that? I am stuck in a situation where I don’t know what to do other than get the guys paid up the best I can.

“I do not have the answer why people aren’t coming. I don’t foresee it getting any better.

“My pride is telling me let’s get through the year, moving the team or possibly selling it to local ownership. I may look at it that fans aren’t coming because they want local ownership. I don’t know.

“I take full responsibility for it. I don’t like to give excuses why, it can be a number of things. The bottom line is, it’s happening and I have to get through it the best way that I can.

“I am actively trying to get the players paid up.

“People not been paid. But, look what I’m working with. I’m not even getting 500 fans a game and why? That’s the golden question. No one can really give me the answer that I’m looking for or what can be done better. People are pointing fingers at me, which is cool, I can deal with that. But, at the same time, help the situation out.

“This has been a strain on me mentally, physically, emotionally. It’s a strain on my family to hold onto something that may be possibly out of my league. Even with the things I possibly might do, people still may not come.

“If I spend $10,000 in advertising, what if that’s not the answer.”

This is not the same team that began the season. They are the same players, but not the same team.

“It’s not the same team. It’s not the same team, morale is down,” said Ross. “How do you build morale? How do you boost morale? You do you have guys that get up and are afraid to go out here and play hard because, if they get hurt, we got to tell them, ‘you’re on your own, our insurance is not going to cover everything because we decided to go the cheapest route because we have no money.”

“Workman’s comp already is initially paid to get it started,” said the owner. “We pay that in six-month premiums and we haven’t been around for six months. People don’t know how workman’s comp is actually set up.”

“It’s just crazy. It’s just crazy what we’re asking these players to come out here and do,” said Ross. “I feel bad about asking them to play another game under these circumstances. We need community support. We need community stability in order for this team to succeed.”

So, will there be a game at 7 p.m. Saturday against Springfield at St. John Arena?

“It’s hard for me to answer that, I haven’t spoken with the coach,” said Davenport. “I can’t really guarantee that, I can only hope. I can’t also step up and say these guys have to play. These guys are grown men, like myself.

“I’m looking at definitely more investors and looking toward the league to come in and give some guidance and assistance on what to do to make it through the year.”

Davenport also owns the Summit County Rumble.

“I bought both teams late,” he said. “I bought Steubenville in January. I bought Wayne County in July, but we moved in January. I have not had a full year to advertise and have sponsorship dollars. The Akron market is not a burnt market.

“Honestly, Steubenville is going to be difficult after what happened last year and what is going on right now. It’s going to be difficult for anyone coming in and be hard for them to do indoor football.

“That person has to have deep, deep, deep pockets. It’s going to take a lot of money to resurrect it where people actually are coming out.

“I think the interest is gone.”

“I signed up for the good and the bad,” said Ross. “I signed up with every intention of having help — help by the community if I did my part by putting a successful great team out there with great character and great ability.

“Because everyone told me, ‘you’re going to get the support if you win.’ Well, we were 4-0 and we still only had maybe 600 or 700 people here and most of them were giveaways.

“It’s hard to get up for things like this and keep morale up on my players when every time they come out of the tunnel and want to celebrate and look up and there’s nobody there to enjoy it.

“It’s tough. It’s real hard and it is frustrating. But, you know, it comes with the territory. So, am I taking it? I don’t have no choice. We’re going to do the best that we can under these circumstances.

“But, I don’t know if I can ask them to play another game under those same conditions.”

Sykotyk
05-08-2007, 01:14 PM
Well, I responded on AIFA Fans to this, but I'll duplicate it here. Ramone has done nothing to promote this team. Everything he has done is through tradeoffs. Him crying that the fans aren't supporting him. He's done nothing but 'show up'. This team needed a lot of promotion prior to the season, and it's sad he's too poor, and the CIFL too weak, to both allow him to run a team, let alone two, and to let him run them into the ground.

Sykotyk

jwalters
05-08-2007, 02:19 PM
I posted something to this effect on the Springfield thread and it was kinda misunderstood. Look 10k is nothing for advertising during the season. The Stampede play 7 home games. To properly market they need to spend something in the area of $28,000 to $35,000. That is marketing with nothing super fancy. Less than $2,000 per game is fine for baseball teams but not indoor football. No one comes to games because no one really knows about the team. They might just think it is a semi-pro or rec league team. Combine that with the fact that the O.V. Greyhounds are only 30 miles away and are a UIF team. They don't have a chance.

exit322
05-08-2007, 03:38 PM
OV has nothing at all to do with Steubenville's failures - as someone who went to Greyhounds games, rarely did I ever see any Steubenville Big Red clothing on fans (and an awful lot of people wear high school stuff to sporting events). That said, OV is also doing nothing to let people up there know there is a team down south (not that many would go).

The first part of your statement hits it on the head...Ramone didn't spend a dime on advertising, and as such no one knows (or cares) there is a team in Steubenville.

rowbo
05-08-2007, 09:08 PM
Hello everyone. I'm very new to the CIFL and other indoor leagues, like the NIFL, UIF, etc. I actually do know a few of the Revolution players and I'm also a sponsor for their team.

I've been reading and noticing quite a few articles and postings on how many teams in all the various leagues seem to be having difficulties staying afloat for an entire season. Is this the norm?

Do any league officers, in any indoor league, mandate any type of working(liquid) capital requirement to avoid situations as such? Similar to when someone purchases a business franchise. Hooters for example, last I read, required an initial investment of $350,000 and the ownership group must have proof of at least $2,000,000 in potential working capital.

Do any leagues do any type of demographical research prior to expansion or can anyone with the right amount of money, put a team in any market they'd like?

Thanks for your time.

exit322
05-08-2007, 09:32 PM
AF2 and UIF do for sure - not sure on the others, though I think the WIFL does.

ChampionOfSteel
05-09-2007, 08:42 AM
Hello everyone. I'm very new to the CIFL and other indoor leagues, like the NIFL, UIF, etc. I actually do know a few of the Revolution players and I'm also a sponsor for their team.

I've been reading and noticing quite a few articles and postings on how many teams in all the various leagues seem to be having difficulties staying afloat for an entire season. Is this the norm?

Do any league officers, in any indoor league, mandate any type of working(liquid) capital requirement to avoid situations as such? Similar to when someone purchases a business franchise. Hooters for example, last I read, required an initial investment of $350,000 and the ownership group must have proof of at least $2,000,000 in potential working capital.

Do any leagues do any type of demographical research prior to expansion or can anyone with the right amount of money, put a team in any market they'd like?

Thanks for your time.

Excellent point! I once researched the requirements to own a McDonald's restaurant franchise in order to pass on ideas to indoor football leagues for organizing their leagues for success.

The problem here is we have the dumb football jock syndrome in full swing. We get former players that want to continue with the sport who do not have the formal business education to do a league/team successfully. Since the commissionership of these leagues normally does not require proof of liquidity like a Hooter's restaurant we see teams folding during the season.

I've been begging for years on message boards to get commissionerships to require huge $$$ proof of liquidity just like the Hooter's (and AF2) business model to bring an end to teams failing during the season. Slowly I think the folks in charge are taking this advice...but not fast enough for me.

Basically what I think is happening here is the guys/gals in charge of teams (wannabe owners) realize they don't have a penny to their name as far as owning a team. In addition, they're falsely convinced with a sellout crowd here and sellout crowd there to begin their home stand of the season, they don't need the safety stock of cash to make it thru the entire season.

exit322
05-09-2007, 09:13 AM
The sellout crowd here and there would likely do it - but you have to put out big bucks in advertising to get enough people to know about it TO get that sellout crowd.

rowbo
05-09-2007, 10:29 AM
Thanks for your quick replies.

I see now. That's sad.

I just feel bad for the players that basically get "robbed" of their paychecks but more importantly, the kids and real fans that have their hearts broken. As a Jersey guy, there was a team out of central NJ, the Trenton Lightning, that basically disappeared in the middle of the night. I'm not sure what league they were in. This was a couple of years back. My friend designed their team's website. Although he said the owner was a "nice' guy, he basically took all the sponsorship money and fled.

Do you know what initial investments costs are to purchase a team in the various leagues? Also, a team's approximate annual expense?

Is it each team's responsibility to secure their own sponsorships? Is there any "league" assistance? In the CIFL, I've noticed Adams USA quite a bit.

The only reason I ask, you guys seem to know the "real deal" and myself and some friends may be interested in potential ownership in the near future but its scary when the structure and foundation isn't there.

Thanks again for all your help

exit322
05-09-2007, 10:34 AM
I don't know that right now indoor football is a good venture, just because of all the turmoil that is going to be happening at a league level. There's so many teams that will be making moves in the next offseason or two that I'd wait a bit.

Adams USA gives CIFL teams 2/3s off on their equipment.

exit322
05-09-2007, 03:26 PM
Here's something about the Stampede: http://www.hsconnect.com/sports/articles.asp?articleID=13549

Sykotyk
05-09-2007, 05:33 PM
The other problem is that indoor football generally doesn't have a high rate of return on investment, and the rate of failure is very high. Only people with a penchant for the impossible give it a shot. Legitimate business owners know the one way to make money in sports is to buy low, build up a fan base, build up the worth, and sell before your losses offset the buy/sell margin.

Sykotyk

Sykotyk
05-14-2007, 07:30 AM
Most lower leagues have a $25k franchise fee, and then theirs turf, pads, and walls (if the arena is not equipped) that you must buy. Total annual (non-startup) costs run $200,000-$300,000. The higher, the better, as it gives more money for the 'fringe' things that a barebones operation lacks.

Most of the time you need at least a $100k line-of-credit, although for some it may be as little as $25k (be afraid, be very afraid)....

Sykotyk

exit322
05-14-2007, 08:47 AM
Or in a certain case, $0 or so.

ml91
05-19-2007, 11:47 PM
Does anyone know if the Stampede are going to make their scheduled trip to Worcester on the 26th? Does the CIFL have a plan to make other arrangements if the Stampede are not able to play the game? Maybe no one knows the answers to these questions, but I thought I would ask anyway.

exit322
05-20-2007, 12:28 AM
The Stampede are doing everything they can to make the trip, but it will still be hard with the bandaids and Q-tips being used to cover up the hole created by the sawed-off shotgun.

Tatonka
05-21-2007, 11:35 PM
The Stampede will be there, I'll personally make sure at least half of them get there. ;)

DanTheFan
05-22-2007, 10:59 AM
The Stampede will be there, I'll personally make sure at least half of them get there. ;)I assume you mean the half that isn't being sold off to othe rindoor teams and leagues...

Tatonka
05-22-2007, 03:47 PM
I mean the half that will ride in the van I'm driving...

Players can leave at any time for any league, it's their prerogative... I don't see what you mean by being "sold off..."

phydeaux72
05-22-2007, 04:37 PM
The players are riding in vans? How long of a trip is this?

Tatonka
05-22-2007, 06:02 PM
Long enough.

ml91
05-27-2007, 07:52 PM
I'm not sure who you drove to Worcester on Saturday, but I don't think it was the Steubenville Stampede. There were 13 players with Stampede uniforms, but I don't think they were Steubenville Stampede players.

exit322
05-28-2007, 01:59 PM
They weren't. It was the same semi-pro team that played as Springfield in Steubenville.

It's good that the league has a group of players ready to go in a situation like this, but it's apparent the replacement team isn't quite ready to play at this level.

ml91
05-29-2007, 12:03 AM
You mean the Mansfield semi-pro players tore the Springfield Stallions decals off their helmets, replaced them with Steubenville Stampede decals, and became the "new" Steubenville Stampede? That's hilarious! You can't make up stuff that funny!

exit322
05-29-2007, 10:41 AM
They might have actually had the real Stampede jerseys and stuff; I don't know.

ml91
05-29-2007, 12:52 PM
The "Steubenville 13" (as they were referred to in the Worcester newspaper) wore white jerseys with black numbers on them, and black helmets. I think the "original" Stampede wore white helmets, but I am not sure.

exit322
05-29-2007, 04:03 PM
The "Steubenville 13" (as they were referred to in the Worcester newspaper) wore white jerseys with black numbers on them, and black helmets. I think the "original" Stampede wore white helmets, but I am not sure.


Okay, that works. I wouldn't know, I was just speculating on the jersey issue.

WorcShark
05-30-2007, 07:30 PM
New England 86, Steubenville 0

WORCESTER, Mass.—The run continues in New England. The Surge have now won five-straight games and are 6-3 on the year.

The latest victory came on an 86-0 drubbing of a depleted and short-handed Steubenville squad at the DCU Center in Worcester, Mass.

So is that what we are calling replacement teams now?

Another one I liked from their message board was:
Most of you don't even know what the situation is in Steubenville, you're just hearing rumors. Come Tuesday, there will be a press release regarding the situation in Steubenville that will answer a lot of questions.

I guess it will come once the stats come in. Or maybe they haven't figured out what spin to put on the situation.

:oops: :oops: :twisted:

ChampionOfSteel
05-30-2007, 08:13 PM
New England 86, Steubenville 0

WORCESTER, Mass.—The run continues in New England. The Surge have now won five-straight games and are 6-3 on the year.

The latest victory came on an 86-0 drubbing of a depleted and short-handed Steubenville squad at the DCU Center in Worcester, Mass.

So is that what we are calling replacement teams now?

Another one I liked from their message board was:
Most of you don't even know what the situation is in Steubenville, you're just hearing rumors. Come Tuesday, there will be a press release regarding the situation in Steubenville that will answer a lot of questions.

I guess it will come once the stats come in. Or maybe they haven't figured out what spin to put on the situation.

:oops: :oops: :twisted:

At this point who cares?

This all comes back to a foundational difference on funding. Many of the volunteers/semi-volunteers/employees of indoor football here on OSC have no objections to running a league on absent funds from the get-go...yet are amazed year after year with the same result (NIFL-like results).

I don't believe in doing that. I prefer the UIF, WIFL, and AF2 business plan where only teams that are loaded ($$$), are included in the schedule. Bottom line is if you can't take a financial hit, you don't get a team. Get a job (or a second job) and build up your personal coffers until you can do this venture and take a heavy financial hit.

I could not live with myself doing the replacement team option. I'd rather do everything to bring an end to the season immediately than put on massacre games and gyp the season ticket holders. They apparently have to do this because their game-by-game accrued/unearned revenue (look it up wannabe owners) from ticket season sales has already been spent. That is unethical. Probably not illegal but unethical nevertheless. Apparently no one in charge has a college education in accounting either or any sense of values when it comes to business ethics -- is this from ignorance or by choice to be personally non-compliant? Neither is encouraging.

Going to a game like you mentioned above is like seeing a community theatre production of the King and I with Peter Griffin and his dog Brian as a comedy, when you were presented with a Hollywood non-comedy quality product before you bought your tickets for the said event back in February.

If it's too expensive to follow the UIF, AF2, WIFL business plan you flatout don't have a team/league in the first place.

Truth hurts.

Now I'm going to sit back with a bowl of popcorn and a cherry Coke and read all of the biased sympathizers who have a stake in this league continuing (a majority probably here at OSC that post) that will go with the flow (no backbone). I'm sure I'll be asked to appear in Canton in a fan conference. Maybe we can get the fine folks at Moohead Radio to moderate a debate of some type.

P.S. Sorry my response was like a volume of War and Peace.

exit322
05-30-2007, 09:13 PM
Wow...a well thought-out post from CoS! What's the world coming to?

Few people disagree with this assessment. You've been attacked before because your comments are usually inane.

Lack of funding is the integral problem in this game. It always has been. It's not a game system like some people like to harp on and on about.

Pounder
05-31-2007, 12:57 PM
I've been tossing around with good old logical thought about this. I think I'm onto something.

If 80 people with more money performed a 1-for-1 replacement of current ownership throughout indoor football, what would change? Would more money guarantee finding better coaches?

Or is one problem simply that there's so many leagues running around now that there aren't enough quality coaches? I would include "GMs" in terms of people who can FIND talent in places others may not look, but it's my understanding that this role is usually left to coaches.

It's possible, at least from the view of my warped brain, that America is simply oversaturated with indoor and arena football teams... not from lack of players as much as lack of people who can coach and/or find talent and/or figure out how to run this business. Heck, it's possible that the bigger problem is simply that there aren't enough owners to sustain this number of teams and leagues. Not NEARLY everyone with money has the desire to get into sports.

ChampionOfSteel
05-31-2007, 01:29 PM
I've been tossing around with good old logical thought about this. I think I'm onto something.

If 80 people with more money performed a 1-for-1 replacement of current ownership throughout indoor football, what would change? Would more money guarantee finding better coaches?

Or is one problem simply that there's so many leagues running around now that there aren't enough quality coaches? I would include "GMs" in terms of people who can FIND talent in places others may not look, but it's my understanding that this role is usually left to coaches.

It's possible, at least from the view of my warped brain, that America is simply oversaturated with indoor and arena football teams... not from lack of players as much as lack of people who can coach and/or find talent and/or figure out how to run this business. Heck, it's possible that the bigger problem is simply that there aren't enough owners to sustain this number of teams and leagues. Not NEARLY everyone with money has the desire to get into sports.

Anyone can be an owner. But few folks have tremendous disposable income to make it thru an entire year without the negative consequences. The supply of quality players and coaches exceeds the supply of rich folks wanting to be owners.

I think the quote in the book "The $3 League" says it all: "What's the best way to become a millionaire? Be a multi-millionaire and own a football team."

Thanks to the stupidity in the CIFL we had one owner, owning two teams who did not have a dime to his name. No sympathy to the CIFL here.

preeths
05-31-2007, 02:00 PM
If 80 people with more money performed a 1-for-1 replacement of current ownership throughout indoor football, what would change? Would more money guarantee finding better coaches?

By and large, yes. Maybe not in every specific circumstance would more money bring in better coaching and management talent, but it would overall. The AFL has been playing for more than two decades and has produced a lot of guys who would have no trouble coaching the indoor game. For instance, two of the NIFL's better league-owned expansion teams (on the field), Fort Myers and Atlanta, had ex-indoor/Arena players assemble and coach the teams before they walked out. The guys with no or only semipro experience are the ones who struggled, much as we've seen in the other indoor leagues.