Keep Feeding The Monster !

[WHAFAN]

As long as you keep "supporting" the ABA, nothing will ever change. If teams draw 40 people to a game, but the league office continues to rake in the cash, why would anything change? If Joe had any balls, he'd only collect on his franchise fees AFTER a successful season, this way he'd have to keep his promises about changes, organization record keeping, updating websites, having financially viable teams and solid fan bases. Once he gets the money, its every team for itself. Thats whats ruining this rec-league. Joe knows nothing will ever change, therefore he has no reason to try to change the ills of this thing. If you sold your house and didn't get paid in full for one year, AFTER all the proper repairs have been made, you'd be damn sure to make them as quickly as possible. Once you close the house deal and turn over the keys, do you careless if the place collapses? You got paid..........who cares? Right Joe??

[jamesaba]

First of all the ABA league office is hardly "raking in the money"...if you had a chance to review the prospectus for the public company and read the accountants audit, you would know that the ABA league office only generates a few hundred thousand dollars a year and operates at a net loss.

Secondly, once a team is operating and drawing only 40 people - that is the team's fault - they are on their own to succeed or fail. Good, bad, or indifferent - thats they way it is right now.

Thirdly, the league is not getting any money from that team or any team in the future - there are no dues.

What the ABA should do is raise the entrance fee to 50 or 100k. Then only team's with enough money to afford the entrance fee will join.

[The Sweeper]

Normally I let stuff like this pass, but now, I got to say something. Do I support the ABA by going to Frost Heaves games? Maybe. I do know, like Jamesaba stated, that sales of tickets, merchandise and stuff like that goes right back to the team. How much do I support the Frost Heaves? Thursday night will be their 18th and final home game of the regular season. I have attended 17 of them (missed the Strong Island game, and have been regretting it ever since). I have put over 4300 miles on my car going to their games. I will continue to go to their games no matter what the weather is, no matter what league they are in and no matter what thier record is. If they come back to the ABA next year, I will be there too. I buy clothing with their logo on it, I have created wallpaper for my cell phones with their logo, I place their logo in the back window of my car. I have their logo on my computer both at home and at work. When Alex asked me to be the 13th man for the Maryland game instead of the Newark game, I didn't hesitate. He needed someone to fill in and I was more than grateful to do the job (took a half day off without pay to do it too). Why? They've given me so much, it was time to return the favor.

I can guarantee you that there are FAR more than 40 people at our games. Why not make a trek to Barre if we host the first playoff game there? Would the sound of 1650 yelling, cheering, cowbell ringing people offend you? Better bring ear plugs if it does.


We have sponsors that get involved with the team. The Barre-Montpelier Times Argus handed out mini cowbells at the first and second home games in Barre. Last Saturday night, they gave out even more cowbells free of charge. Northfield Savings Bank sponsors the Heaves' 13th man and that person shoots hoops at halftime for charity. Ben & Jerry's sponsors the team bus. Coach V and Bump (our mascot) did a commercial for another sponsor (Vermont Eye Laser)

Maybe not all teams are run like the Heaves, but I do know that Alex and Mike have a lot of intregrity and would not allow some pick-up team to fill in for a scheduled game when the original team cancels.

Sorry for the rant, but it needed to be done.

[heavesrock]

Sweeper, I think you just expressed what I lot of vermont fans feel.

[nksports]

??Yámesaba;36102]First of all the ABA league office is hardly "raking in the money"...if you had a chance to review the prospectus for the public company and read the accountants audit, you would know that the ABA league office only generates a few hundred thousand dollars a year and operates at a net loss.

Secondly, once a team is operating and drawing only 40 people - that is the team's fault - they are on their own to succeed or fail. Good, bad, or indifferent - thats they way it is right now.

Thirdly, the league is not getting any money from that team or any team in the future - there are no dues.

What the ABA should do is raise the entrance fee to 50 or 100k. Then only team's with enough money to afford the entrance fee will join.[/QUOTE]

I doubt the league itself is raking in the money, but I think there is a lot of money coming in. It got $2.5 million in the reverse merger that took it public, but that money is probably out of the league's reach.
A team that is only drawing 40 people a game is a team that didn't do it's research in the first place. It's either run by someone who doesn't belong in pro sports, or it's there to reduce someone's tax burden or to launder drug money.
Third — I doubt the league (or Joe) is going to give up a big fat check when letting a team in.
Finally, the league should be charging a high enough fee when a team comes in, backed up by performance bonds and background checks. Right now, the only check for the league is to make sure the check clears.
Thus endeth the rant.

[WHAFAN]

I would personally be offended by being anywhere near someone with a cowbell.......is this a rodeo or a basketball game? I guess the farm boy, cowbell connection ties in perfectly, since the ABA is nothing but a cowsh*t league in the first place. 1600 fans? Is that a huge deal? Chicago draws 9,500 for lacrosse of all things !! The minor league hockey team, the Wolves draw 16,000 on a Saturday night. And no cowbells...........why not have a "Squirt Maple Syrup On Each Other Night"?

[psbf]

We all know that the league is far from perfect, but there are some good teams competing. But I fail to understand why you are comparing Chicago to Vermont, WHAFAN. They are completely different.
I admire what they have done in Vermont, making the best from what they have. If using cowbells is a fan favorite, so be it. I respect them and I'm glad to see them doing well, especially for not having had a pro team before. There is nothing wrong with using a little creativity and if it turns out to be popular, so much the better. Each ABA location has their own methods of getting fans out. If it does not work, then something else has to be done. If it does, then stick with it. I say to Vermont and their fans, More power to you!

[The Sweeper]

Looks like I’ll have to remember to carry my cowbell if I am ever in Chicago.

Every team need something for the fans to get involved in. Do the Detroit Red Wings fans still throw an octopus on the ice? Do hockey fans in general still throw hats onto the ice after a player scores a hat trick? Do the Chicago Blackhawks still let off the loud horn after every Blackhawk goal? Do the fans in Montreal break out singing “Na na na na, na na na na, hey hey, goodbye” during the late stages of a game when they are leading (they did back when they played in the Forum)? The cow bells are now a part of every Frost Heave game, and I am glad that you will never step foot in the Aud, or the Memorial, for that matter.

Let’s talk population, ok? The City of Chicago has a population of 2,800,000. The City of Burlington, VT has a population of 38,000. The City of Barre, VT has a population of 9100. We do not have an arena that seats what the United Center in Chicago does. Even if we did, every citizen in Barre would not be enough to fill the arena. And more than half of the population of Burlington would have to attend the game for it to be a sell out. You make due with what you have. Maybe Chicago does have huge arenas and stadiums. Vermont does not. When 1650 people show up in Barre, with 300 lining up outside in -5 wind chill an hour and a half before game time, it IS a big deal (been told there were a few that had to be turned away). Considering even David Stern notices what Alex is doing, he most be doing something right.

You go ahead and rag on us if you want. I can’t stop you. All I can do is defend the team. By the way, if the “Squirt Maple Syrup On Each Other Night” was for charity, The Heaves might just put something like that on, and I’d be there, cowbell I hand, to support them.

[preeths]

WHAFAN, you're barking up the wrong tree. I fail to understand why you have targeted one of the few solid ABA teams when there are literally dozens of shaky organizations in the league. Whatever the Frost Heaves are doing in Vermont, it's working. That's the bottom line, and it doesn't matter one bit what Chicagoans or anyone else thinks about it. If even 20 percent of the ABA ran their franchises the way Vermont does, the league would be in much better shape.

[bdaly]

Chicago draws 9,500 for lacrosse of all things !!
I'll call you on this one. Chicago's best crowd was a bit over 8,400. Their average is 6,522, which lands them 11th in a 13 team league. The NLL is the highest-level indoor lacrosse league, and the league averages over 10K per game. It's apples to oranges.

[Pounder]

WHA, while practicing what soccer fans would call "persistent infringement," if I read this correctly, simply believes that anything that actually makes Joe Newman look good is not good.

There's a point to which I might agree on this. I believe that doink doesn't deserve Vermont. It certainly doesn't deserve Rochester.

Of course, there's that danger of going so hardcore against something (and not a big something at that) that you end up planting yourself in the social outcast box. WHAFAN, I'm talking to you.

Here's hoping the Frost Heaves find a legitimate league in which to thrive.

****************

EDIT- BTW, the issue is not where game receipts and concession sales go. The issue is that Newman could show Rochester and Vermont and con someone into believing it could happen in Walla Walla at his price.

[sportsguy12]

First of all the ABA league office is hardly "raking in the money"...if you had a chance to review the prospectus for the public company and read the accountants audit, you would know that the ABA league office only generates a few hundred thousand dollars a year and operates at a net loss.

Secondly, once a team is operating and drawing only 40 people - that is the team's fault - they are on their own to succeed or fail. Good, bad, or indifferent - thats they way it is right now.

Thirdly, the league is not getting any money from that team or any team in the future - there are no dues.

What the ABA should do is raise the entrance fee to 50 or 100k. Then only team's with enough money to afford the entrance fee will join.

where does the $10,000 market reservation fee go? No, there aren't dues but don't try to convince me for a second that that money doesn't line Joe's pockets a bit. The league sets up all of the team websites, which suck for the most part.

I'm not touching the blame for lack of attendance.

[sportsguy12]

Normally I let stuff like this pass, but now, I got to say something. Do I support the ABA by going to Frost Heaves games? Maybe. I do know, like Jamesaba stated, that sales of tickets, merchandise and stuff like that goes right back to the team. How much do I support the Frost Heaves? Thursday night will be their 18th and final home game of the regular season. I have attended 17 of them (missed the Strong Island game, and have been regretting it ever since). I have put over 4300 miles on my car going to their games. I will continue to go to their games no matter what the weather is, no matter what league they are in and no matter what thier record is. If they come back to the ABA next year, I will be there too. I buy clothing with their logo on it, I have created wallpaper for my cell phones with their logo, I place their logo in the back window of my car. I have their logo on my computer both at home and at work. When Alex asked me to be the 13th man for the Maryland game instead of the Newark game, I didn't hesitate. He needed someone to fill in and I was more than grateful to do the job (took a half day off without pay to do it too). Why? They've given me so much, it was time to return the favor.

I can guarantee you that there are FAR more than 40 people at our games. Why not make a trek to Barre if we host the first playoff game there? Would the sound of 1650 yelling, cheering, cowbell ringing people offend you? Better bring ear plugs if it does.


We have sponsors that get involved with the team. The Barre-Montpelier Times Argus handed out mini cowbells at the first and second home games in Barre. Last Saturday night, they gave out even more cowbells free of charge. Northfield Savings Bank sponsors the Heaves' 13th man and that person shoots hoops at halftime for charity. Ben & Jerry's sponsors the team bus. Coach V and Bump (our mascot) did a commercial for another sponsor (Vermont Eye Laser)

Maybe not all teams are run like the Heaves, but I do know that Alex and Mike have a lot of intregrity and would not allow some pick-up team to fill in for a scheduled game when the original team cancels.

Sorry for the rant, but it needed to be done.

at the Vermonts, Rochesters and other model franchises in the ABA. They were directed at those which have or will very soon fold up shop - never to be heard of again. I'd say 1/3 of the teams in the ABA would be the target of the comments.

[tbayz1]

here in Buffalo we got a lax team, i think highest crowd was 17,000+ this year and their avg is like 12-15k a game, uhh another team the Silverbacks have to compete with in the media etc... lol

[bomp]

I didn't realize that Burlington was THAT small. The Heaves are doing GREAT IMHO.

It's good trhat the Heaves have loyal fans like youse guys. Teams need that kind of loyality and it really helps to see an owner that give 200%. It does make a difference.