Opening Game attendance CBA...... NOT GOOD

[BasketballUSA]

When one company owns three to four teams in one league, something will give very soon. This business model will NOT work. CBA will not survive with such poor turnouts ( exception Yakama). The company that owns the teams does NOT appear to have the funds to sustain the teams over the long haul. This is based on insider information and how accurate it is , we shall soon see.
Meanwhile it looks like some company has invested a ton of money into the ABA, now where that will take them, time will also tell. The NBA teams are now seriously considering placing NBDL teams in there own cities, again how smart is that? Time will tell. By the way...what time is it in minor league basketball???

[suge night]

Last night less than 100 people watched the D-League Flyers play the Arsenal,by the way your suggestion about bad business model is being done in the D as well Fort worth and 3 other teams are owned by the same company and before the start of this season they went looking for more income they didn't get it .So question is how long can they go ? I was at the game in person and saw the attendence myself.

[bdaly]

Paid crowd of 1,047 in Great Falls with the paper saying it was closer to 700. Not a good way to kick off a franchise, but I'm surprised to see that the CBA is having a fair number of weekday games. I'd stick to flying people in for Friday/Saturday series when at all possible. Especially having a home opener on a Tuesday is a tough way to start.

http://www.greatfallstribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061206/NEWS01/612060301

[sportsguy12]

Paid crowd of 1,047 in Great Falls with the paper saying it was closer to 700. Not a good way to kick off a franchise, but I'm surprised to see that the CBA is having a fair number of weekday games. I'd stick to flying people in for Friday/Saturday series when at all possible. Especially having a home opener on a Tuesday is a tough way to start.

http://www.greatfallstribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061206/NEWS01/612060301

against each other. It's too bad the strongest of the teams can't get together to form one developmental league. Take Albany and Yakama from the CBA, Rochester and a few others (very few) from the ABA and the best of the D-League and put together a 30-team minor league.

I know it's been kicked around before, but the time is now.

[one way]

everyone has been saying that APex is doomed to fail because it owns all of these franchises- maybe the guy is rich and loves basketball. Is it any different than a guy who owns race horses or huge boats. I know that nascar owners lose tons of money. If this is what he wants to spend his money on and can afford to lose money, then why not? If APex is a muti-muti millionare- what is the difference if he owns basketball teams or race horses? Maybe he loves it and that what he wants to do

[bdaly]

against each other. It's too bad the strongest of the teams can't get together to form one developmental league. Take Albany and Yakama from the CBA, Rochester and a few others (very few) from the ABA and the best of the D-League and put together a 30-team minor league.

I know it's been kicked around before, but the time is now.
Ultimately, I think it'll shake out that way. An affiliated AAA with independent leagues that are generally seen as AA or lower. Somewhat similar to hockey. I think it's in the NBA's interest to make it happen, and I don't think any of the other leagues are doing such a great job that it'll get in their way. The D-League may not be a cash cow for them, but if they can get it to a breakeven point (or close), they'd probably be happy for both developmental and promotional reasons. For example, they can then really use those teams to crosspromote the nearest NBA team(s). For example, in Rochester and Buffalo they could pump Cleveland and Toronto.

[suge night]

You have the right idea if they ever sell a league like the D for what it really is AAA level basketball then the public might buy into it then the trickle down to AA and A and a rookie and short season A level then the public will support it but not in large numbers.But this none since of a D league with really no more than two legit NBA players on them and charge you $10.00 to see the game with $75.00 court side seats (Flyers) it should cost $5.00 general admission you get the point.........

[bdaly]

Any $75 seats are too much, but I see no problem with $10 seats. Teams aren't going to make money on $5 seats. Even in the ABA, Razorsharks seats range from $9.50 to $25. $10 seats are generally the low price for AHL hockey and it's mid to high for AAA baseball.

[suge night]

AAA teams maybe $10.00 but making money when they are not bright enough not to play at the big complex,look minor league sports isn't the game to make big money on your team let's face it paying guys who may be good players but will never put foot on the big court isn't that bright either you only pay to see one maybe two players on a team and the other reason you would show up is that the team is good enough to win,the player on the other hand is trying to show he is worthy of a look from the big boy's it's just entertainment.Ok before you say the guy's who can really play won't play on a team like this then that is there lost after all the only other thing they can do is pay to attent somebody's ripoff camp they need video if they didn't get it done in college against quality comp.at least that is what you are sold from the D-1 machine but the truth is most of those teams only have two real ballers sometime three.

[Ken, Steelheads fan]

...Time will tell. By the way...what time is it in minor league basketball???

It is seven minutes to midnight. Time to turn-off the lights on minor league hoops as we know it. The fans obviously aren't interested. There are always exceptions to a rule, but generally speaking, fans are finding other pursuits to be fanatic about.

Paid crowd of 1,047 in Great Falls with the paper saying it was closer to 700. Not a good way to kick off a franchise, but I'm surprised to see that the CBA is having a fair number of weekday games. I'd stick to flying people in for Friday/Saturday series when at all possible. Especially having a home opener on a Tuesday is a tough way to start.

This is what happens when a league is thrown together at the last minute. The good arena dates are already taken.

everyone has been saying that APex is doomed to fail because it owns all of these franchises- maybe the guy is rich and loves basketball. Is it any different than a guy who owns race horses or huge boats. I know that nascar owners lose tons of money. If this is what he wants to spend his money on and can afford to lose money, then why not? If APex is a muti-muti millionare- what is the difference if he owns basketball teams or race horses? Maybe he loves it and that what he wants to do

If...If...If...If the people at Apex were multi-multi millionaires, then they would have secured Reno as a CBA location. Remember Reno? Money talks.

[psbf]

ok, Ken. We all know how you feel about it. But would it be too much to ask if you could have some respect for those of us who actually support our teams? I'm so tired of reading about posters bashing the CBA, which has been going on even before the season started. I've said it before, I'm glad my city has a team and I'm proud to support the Pgh. Xplosion!

[bectond]

Thus far attendance in the CBA is down 22%, excluding the Utah Eagles the average CBA game has drawn 1,842 fasn down from 2426 last year. Yakame once again is leading the league in attendeance at 3,009 per game, however that is a 21% decrease from last years average. The D-League (excluding) LA is averaging 2382 per game because of the addition of the former CBA clubs, Sioux Falls is leading the way at 4,026 per game. Two of the new teams Minot and Butte are 2nd and 3rd in attendance in the CBA, so why is Apex the focus of this thread? Both are outdrawing Albany.

[Chuck the Writer]

Thus far attendance in the CBA is down 22%, excluding the Utah Eagles the average CBA game has drawn 1,842 fasn down from 2426 last year. Yakame once again is leading the league in attendeance at 3,009 per game, however that is a 21% decrease from last years average. The D-League (excluding) LA is averaging 2382 per game because of the addition of the former CBA clubs, Sioux Falls is leading the way at 4,026 per game. Two of the new teams Minot and Butte are 2nd and 3rd in attendance in the CBA, so why is Apex the focus of this thread? Both are outdrawing Albany.

Well, Albany had to move its second home date up to the afternoon so that they wouldn't go up against the UAlbany-Siena matchup that drew 11,000 to the Pepsi Arena. But with a 3-1 record (and TJ Thompson getting his scoring touch back, dropped 42 points on Great Falls, including 8 3-pointers), the crowds should increase once the Pats get back home and face Minot - and the "no handshake" rivalry between Chris Daleo and Micheal Ray Richardson, which has the makings of a Bill Musselman-Phil Jackson CBA rivalry from the 1980's, will progress.

As for Ken, he's just got sour grapes because his team CHOKED the CBA championship away last year, and instead of trying to fight for that championship this year (and having an in-state rival in the Indiana Alley Cats), the Steelheads turned flipper and swam away to the USBL. Yeah, attendance is down somewhat for opening week, but when the D-League cherry-picks three of the CBA's top franchises, and three others either fold or run away, some "rebuilding" is in order. Essentially that's akin to burning down three of the best houses in the neighborhood, knocking down two others, foreclosing on a third, and then griping about why the property values on the other two houses have dropped precipitously.

But as I've said before, the CBA has come back from worse times. Don't forget that they're trying to bring positive basketball back into cities that have been scorched by the ABA. Fans just need a little time to realize that the CBA isn't going to promise games and not play them, or fold franchises and send YMCA scrubs in their uniforms for road contests.

[bdaly]

Pittsburgh announced 1,130 last night (400 actual according to the paper), while Great Falls had a paid crowd of 875. These are pretty, well, ABAish crowds so far. But, the Pittsburgh paper did acknowledge the basketball was a notch above most games last year. It's too bad Pittsburgh didn't start a little stronger at the gate, it seemed like they were doing all the right things to get noticed. Great Falls looks like an uphill battle, but we'll see how they do on weekends.

[panchess]

..here is a team that has had every advantage, for a minor league team.

The team has been organized for a full year before it started play. It is in an exurban region of Denver (somewhat like the Alley Cats in the CBA). It plays in a brand-new, purpose-built arena. Its general manager was the former commissioner of the CBA, who also has experience running a minor league basketball team. The team is in the D-League and appears to have deep pocket owners. They are affiliated with the Denver Nuggets, and receive regular publicity in the area papers.

Their home opening attendance on a Sunday? 1.451.

How come nobody here is throwing them under the bus, and saying the team should fold, etc, etc.

Let's give some of the new CBA teams a chance. The CBA is a bit mercurial, but it isn't the ABA with teams folding every week.

[bdaly]

I actually don't think placing teams in NBA markets is wise in almost any circumstance. An exception I can see is if an outside region has a great sense of community and local media channels. I'm not surprised by the Colorado crowd, and I suspect they'll have an uphill battle. Teams, when affiliated with the major league team, occasionally succeeds in major league cities (Philadelphia in the AHL, Toronto is doing okay but not great). Chicago is really the exception since they have no ties to the major league team, and that comes partially from how poorly run the NHL team is.

I think the CBA has made some mistakes similar to the ABA this year. Last minute team additions, some questionable owners, and not surprisingly two teams folded before the season started. It's not as bad as what has happened in the ABA over the years. However, it showed a little desperation and I think it was understandably the case. As long as these owners have the resources to make it through with crowds under 1,000 the league may be okay (and they will lose loads of money with the travel). At eight teams, there can't be any casualties. It's unfortunate that these CBA teams have failed to generate the buzz most successful minor league teams can at least get initially.

Even from a league perspective, as of now, there hasn't been a new news item posted on the CBA website since before the season started (November 30th). Most scores are added in a somewhat reasonable manner, but there are no actual news items. Ultimately, there's no reason to give up on the CBA. But, I also think there are some considerable improvements to be made. So, let's see if they turn it around. Otherwise, the viability seems questionable. Although I know it has been that way for a long time in the CBA and they always seem to piece together enough teams for the next season.

[Sam Hill]

Pittsburgh announced 1,130 last night (400 actual according to the paper)

300, actually.

Which is not good.

So much for the advertising and the free media and Kevin Pitsnogle and all those things that are supposed to magically make tickets sell themselves.

I know there was competition that night. 300 is still an inauspicious beginning. This organization has yet to prove that it can actually sell tickets.

I'm not ready to mark them down as a disaster yet, let's give them a few games and see what happens when they're playing on a weekend.

But this is not by any stretch of the imagination a good start.

[heavesrock]

I think there were more than 300 people there. There are 500 season ticket holder according to that very same paper. I would figure at least 300 of them would come. If 300 of them came that would mean there were ZERO other fans. I somehow doubt that. I actually believe that figure(1,130).

[Sam Hill]

You believe that figure as what?

It's completely made up. The reporter who was there said 18 people were there shortly before tipoff and about 300 were there during the game.

If they have 500 season ticket holders (which I also seriously doubt), they could conceivably announce 700 or so, but 1,130? That's complete and utter b.s.

800 people don't get tickets and stay home.

[Ken, Steelheads fan]

ok, Ken. We all know how you feel about it. But would it be too much to ask if you could have some respect for those of us who actually support our teams? I'm so tired of reading about posters bashing the CBA, which has been going on even before the season started. I've said it before, I'm glad my city has a team and I'm proud to support the Pgh. Xplosion!

Sure! It would not be too much to ask of me...you can always ask. The CBA should have taken the year off to regroup. Yakama and Albany could have pooled their resources to pay Dennis Traux's salary for running the league during the year off. This would be a TRUE union of teams, unlike the multi-team co-ops currently in the CBA.

As for Ken, he's just got sour grapes because his team CHOKED the CBA championship away last year, and instead of trying to fight for that championship this year (and having an in-state rival in the Indiana Alley Cats), the Steelheads turned flipper and swam away to the USBL...

Yeah, that was the choke of all chokes. Quite upsetting at the time. Several members of the Yakama Nation sat near us during the finals in Gary to make matters worse...nice people though. There wouldn't be an in-state rivalry with the Alley Cats because the Alley Cats don't market.