UHL Expansion

[HockeyFan70]

Several weeks ago after the BOD meeting one of the league officials spoke of prospective expansion cities. Has anyone heard anymore information about future plans? Thanks!

[rams80]

I believe after this last offseason, the immediate goal for the UHL is "survival". Apres ce, the U-Haul will probably try to set up shop in the East to support Elmyra.

[R-Dizzle804]

Personally, i would like to see Elmira move over to the ECHL. Geographically, the Jackals wont be able to survive past this season with the UHL. I see them fitting in better with the North Division in that league (Cincy, Dayton, Toledo, Trenton, Reading, Johnstown, Wheeling, and eventually Burlington) Also, the UHL's attempt to expand into the Eastern part of the country failed miserably, thus proving they need to keep a somewhat stable 10-14 team league in the Midwestern part of the country. Look at the stable clubs in the league that continue to put a decent product on the ice and draw solid crowds: Rockford, Quad City, Fort Wayne, Kalamazoo, and Muskegon. All midwest clubs. I realize Adirondack has been around for awhile and had some success, but most of the eastern clubs have struggled to survive in the past, and i dont see that changing anytime soon.

[PigOut]

Look at the stable clubs in the league that continue to put a decent product on the ice and draw solid crowds: Rockford, Quad City, Fort Wayne, Kalamazoo, and Muskegon.
If the City of Rockford gets their way, the Rockford IceHogs will be a member of the AHL next season.

[sportsguy12]

If the City of Rockford gets their way, the Rockford IceHogs will be a member of the AHL next season.

The Hogs are heading to the AHL -- it's pretty much a done deal from what I've read. They just have to buy the dormant Edmonton franchise and move it to Rockford.

[BreakersFan]

Personally, i would like to see Elmira move over to the ECHL. Geographically, the Jackals wont be able to survive past this season with the UHL. I see them fitting in better with the North Division in that league (Cincy, Dayton, Toledo, Trenton, Reading, Johnstown, Wheeling, and eventually Burlington) Also, the UHL's attempt to expand into the Eastern part of the country failed miserably, thus proving they need to keep a somewhat stable 10-14 team league in the Midwestern part of the country. Look at the stable clubs in the league that continue to put a decent product on the ice and draw solid crowds: Rockford, Quad City, Fort Wayne, Kalamazoo, and Muskegon. All midwest clubs. I realize Adirondack has been around for awhile and had some success, but most of the eastern clubs have struggled to survive in the past, and i dont see that changing anytime soon.


Elmira to the ECHL certainly makes sense, except for the fact that Afr owns the lease at First Arena (even if the Jackals move or fold) and will never let an ECHL or OHL team play there. It's the U or nothing for Elmira.

[Pounder]

From my understanding, it's not that Afr will never let the ECHL in as much as it is the ECHL vowing never to associate with Afr. In the end, same difference.

Chicago has made some moves this week to dump salary. Many think the Hounds are close to folding.

[Minor League Man]

I hope the Sears Centre doesn't end up like the Family Arena (considered a white elephant)

[killer kaminski]

I hope the Sears Centre doesn't end up like the Family Arena (considered a white elephant)
White elephant....whoever wrote that in Wikipedia is ate up, because the new St. Charles County executive is not going to let that happen. He's already booking the Family Arena up, and next season pro hockey will be back.
About halfway through the article.
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=4713
The meeting with Brosal and Ehlmann should be just a formality.

[sportsguy12]

White elephant....whoever wrote that in Wikipedia is ate up, because the new St. Charles County executive is not going to let that happen. He's already booking the Family Arena up, and next season pro hockey will be back.
About halfway through the article.
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=4713
The meeting with Brosal and Ehlmann should be just a formality.

... could work together like minor league baseball.

AHL (30 teams)- AAA
ECHL (30 teams) - AA
CHL (20 teams) and UHL/SPHL (10 teams) - A

Did I miss leagues? I wasn't sure whether CHL is AA or A level. Any thoughts? I think either the UHL or SPHL should go and let their strongest teams merge into other leagues. There's only a need for 1 or 2 "A" league(s).

[nksports]

... could work together like minor league baseball.

AHL (30 teams)- AAA
ECHL (30 teams) - AA
CHL (20 teams) and UHL/SPHL (10 teams) - A

Did I miss leagues? I wasn't sure whether CHL is AA or A level. Any thoughts? I think either the UHL or SPHL should go and let their strongest teams merge into other leagues. There's only a need for 1 or 2 "A" league(s).

Right now, CHL is probably AA, but they tend to carry more veteran players than prospects than ECHL.

[freddypuck]

Seems the league is going to go the other way.

Rockford is going to the AHL and no level of barking by Brosal will change that. This is done...

Chicago has been purchased by one of the Rockford owners. At least thats what I hear from the Chicago land peeps. Official announcement next week. Although doesnt matter who owns it, it is not a market that will make hockey work. too many people after the same entertainment dollars.

Kalamazoo is going to end up in Indianapolis soon.
Motor City moving to the Red Light District (brilliant move)
Flint in trouble - money
Elmira in trouble - travel too much and money
Port Huron - monkey on the back of the city

My bet is still the same with in 2 years, league defunct.

[sportsguy12]

Seems the league is going to go the other way.

Rockford is going to the AHL and no level of barking by Brosal will change that. This is done...

Chicago has been purchased by one of the Rockford owners. At least thats what I hear from the Chicago land peeps. Official announcement next week. Although doesnt matter who owns it, it is not a market that will make hockey work. too many people after the same entertainment dollars.

Kalamazoo is going to end up in Indianapolis soon.
Motor City moving to the Red Light District (brilliant move)
Flint in trouble - money
Elmira in trouble - travel too much and money
Port Huron - monkey on the back of the city

My bet is still the same with in 2 years, league defunct.

This division would make a great Midwest division for ECHL or CHL.
Muskegon
Chicago (Hoffman Estates)
Kalamazoo
Missouri (they're apparently coming back)
Bloomington

I think Fort Wayne and Quad City could easily go AHL with Rockford, although they're running out of slots quickly in the AHL.

That leaves Flint, Elmira and Port Huron as toast.

[ECHLfan]

Agree with Elmira to the ECHL, but what is this deal with the owner of the Elmira arena? (bad blood with the ECHL?)

Rockford is gone to the AHL, and I can see changes in the AHL in the next 2 years (Lowell, Springfield, Omaha maybe one or two others), Ft. Wayne would make a good fit for the AHL, but their owner said he doesn't want to make the move to the AHL.

ECHL - UHL merger quite possible.

Will have to wait and see.

[rams80]

Agree with Elmira to the ECHL, but what is this deal with the owner of the Elmira arena? (bad blood with the ECHL?)

Rockford is gone to the AHL, and I can see changes in the AHL in the next 2 years (Lowell, Springfield, Omaha maybe one or two others), Ft. Wayne would make a good fit for the AHL, but their owner said he doesn't want to make the move to the AHL.

ECHL - UHL merger quite possible.

Will have to wait and see.

AHL has made sure Springfield had a team in the past, probably still will do it.

[indy legend]

Kalamazoo is going to end up in Indianapolis soon.
.

Freddy, what have you heard about the K-wings moving to Indianapolis? I've seen that on here several times but we have heard nothing about it here in Indy. That's to be expected here though because the local media is pathetic when it comes to covering anything but the Colts and our local prison team the Pacers. If local media here were better I'd say they suck but that would be too kind. Our USHL team is drawing about 4500 per game but if you counted on the local paper, TV, and radio to find out about it you'd never know. I really hope you are right on this. Any information you could relay or sources for this would be greatly appreciated. I don't doubt your word, I'd just like to share something concrete with the fans in our section at the Indy Ice game this weekend that will give us all hope that we might be close to getting pro hockey back here. Thanks again Freddy or anyone else out there who might have some insight on this.

[Minor League Man]

Freddy, what have you heard about the K-wings moving to Indianapolis? I've seen that on here several times but we have heard nothing about it here in Indy. That's to be expected here though because the local media is pathetic when it comes to covering anything but the Colts and our local prison team the Pacers. If local media here were better I'd say they suck but that would be too kind. Our USHL team is drawing about 4500 per game but if you counted on the local paper, TV, and radio to find out about it you'd never know. I really hope you are right on this. Any information you could relay or sources for this would be greatly appreciated. I don't doubt your word, I'd just like to share something concrete with the fans in our section at the Indy Ice game this weekend that will give us all hope that we might be close to getting pro hockey back here. Thanks again Freddy or anyone else out there who might have some insight on this.
I think the Wings are staying in K-Zoo...But Indy might get an expansion team soon!

[freddypuck]

Well so far the stars are coming into line... called it so far

Brosal going, going gone.... the feds are looking to tie brosal up with the Galante thing. heard some whispers from people that have been "interviewed" by authorities.. now theres a conviction of the controller for galante, admitting he paid people that were on the Trashers through the garbage company and that the salary cap was exceeded by 475K... http://www.fairfieldcbj.com/archive/030507/0305070006.php. I don't think all of Brosal's nightmares are over yet. Brosal actually committed a conspiracy by trying to cover up the assault of the ref, possibly obstruction of justice... Be nice to see the little guy in an orange suit with his own number on the back. (close your eyes, bet you can see it too)

Indianapolis is still being put together and its somehow tied to Kzoo... I'll try to get more details. But so far it looks to me like its linked to the Kzoo arena and its future. Pickard is heavily involved in this one and is very tight lipped about it.

Chicago now owned by Craig, dealing with the usual residual mess left by Margenau wherever he pitches his temporary tent, its the Margenau trademark. Rape a city leave it for the next deep pocket to try and clean up.

The UHL is in a very precarious situation right now. There are more than a handful of highly unstable franchises and weak markets. The league's finances leave something to be desired. They have several league vendors not getting paid (what else is new). The league's expenses do not go down with the level of teams involved, not equally anyway. So losing Rockford at the end of this season and probably the loss of a couple more teams, the league will have a hard time making ends meet without breaking the backs of the franchises (i.e. league dues, insurance, etc...)With the make up of the league to look something like this.

Rockford -AHL
Quad, Kzoo, Muskegon, Fort Wayne - strong markets, solid owners (these should all CHL and just close down the U.)
Chicago, Port Huron, Bloomington - tough markets to succeed in and my money is on the end of Bloomington and Port Huron this summer. Chicago will hold on for a year because of Craig's passion to do it right, but Margenau's mess may be too much.
Flint - Don't think Perani is willing to keep this thing above water waiting for a miracle.
Elmira can't afford the UHL travel costs and the lack of local/regional rivalry is going to finish it off if they don't go ECHL or maybe the baby NEHL.



As for any new markets... I think most cities will wait it out another year to see how the U shakes out at the end. If the team is not already setting up shop right now in the spring, its too late for next season. you have to come out of the gate early in the year to get the advertising dollars and build the fan base.

[Pounder]

Two-pronged rumor:

Part One- the ECHL has offered reduced rate entry to current UHL teams.

Part Two- if the UHL teams don't jump one way or another, they've bought the old IHL name and intend to use it.

I have no way of knowing how this all turns out; I suspect nobody else does, either.

[BreakersFan]

Well so far the stars are coming into line... called it so far

losing Rockford at the end of this season and probably the loss of a couple more teams, the league will have a hard time making ends meet without breaking the backs of the franchises (i.e. league dues, insurance, etc...)With the make up of the league to look something like this.

Rockford -AHL
Quad, Kzoo, Muskegon, Fort Wayne - strong markets, solid owners (these should all CHL and just close down the U.)
Chicago, Port Huron, Bloomington - tough markets to succeed in and my money is on the end of Bloomington and Port Huron this summer. Chicago will hold on for a year because of Craig's passion to do it right, but Margenau's mess may be too much.
Flint - Don't think Perani is willing to keep this thing above water waiting for a miracle.
Elmira can't afford the UHL travel costs and the lack of local/regional rivalry is going to finish it off if they don't go ECHL or maybe the baby NEHL.



You're probably right on all the teams except Bloomington, which is averaging 3500 or so. Just curious as to why you feel they will fold this summer....

My money is on a 6 team league for 07-08: QC, FW, BLOOM, MUS, KAL, and CHIC. 08-09 is anybody's guess.....

[ECHLfan]

Agree with Pounder, we can listen to the rumors etc., but no one knows a thing. The league (team owners have been probably meeting to figure out what to do), and they will be the ones to decide.

Whatever happens I hope it brings stability for these teams and the UHL or which ever league they happen to join.

Probably hear something soon after the season ends.

[nksports]

I like the IHL idea. That's where I started watching hockey (Go Gems) back in the 60s and 70s. Most of the fans in OH, IN and MI would know the brand.

[freddypuck]

You're probably right on all the teams except Bloomington, which is averaging 3500 or so. Just curious as to why you feel they will fold this summer..... I hope Bloomington stays...hate to see any team fold.

I hope your right... I'd like to see the league stabilize or merge into a more stable situation. these players, coaches and other staff personell work very hard at what they do and deserve to work in a stable, responsible and professional atmosphere.

Reality says they (governors) will have to make some tough decisions this summer. the cannot continue down its current path and if they can't find the right person to clean up the mess that will surely follow Brosal's departure, the league will struggle to survive.

[Nikola_Tesla]

This division would make a great Midwest division for ECHL or CHL.
Muskegon
Chicago (Hoffman Estates)
Kalamazoo
Missouri (they're apparently coming back)
Bloomington

I think Fort Wayne and Quad City could easily go AHL with Rockford, although they're running out of slots quickly in the AHL.

That leaves Flint, Elmira and Port Huron as toast.

I don't know if Fort Wayne could make it from a business standpoint in the American League. But I do know that K's, i.e. the Franke family, will not make that move. They've made that clear. More than once, as a matter of fact. Some of the old school Komet fans (IHL Komet fans) would love to go to the AHL. Who could blame them? I would too!! But, from the business side, I'm more concerned with the K's remaining a viable and profitable venture while being competitive on the ice. I don't think there's any question that the Komets of the UHL have done both. I'd be remiss, if not a hopeless homer, if I didn't say that I think Fort Wayne is a model minor league hockey franchise. There I said it. If that means the K's remain an AA minor league franchise, then so be it. AA Komet hockey is better than no Komet hockey at all.

In Brotherhood,

The Spoiled Komet Homer

[Y2K]

PrairieThunder begins season ticket renewals
Friday, April 13, 2007

Bloomington PrairieThunder officials have announced that information regarding the renewal of season tickets for the 2007-08 hockey season at U.S. Cellular Coliseum have been mailed.

Season ticket-holders from the 2006-07 campaign can renew tickets returning the mailed information along with a 50 percent deposit of the total seat balance due by June 1. The balance of the total will be due no later than Sept. 21.

Prospective new season ticket-holders or current season ticket-holders desiring to add seats or relocate seats should contact Patrick Kelly at 309-434-2664 or at patrickkelly@uscellularcoliseum.com.

Season ticket prices are $560 for club seats; $460 for premium seats (rows A & B); $380 for general (rows C through V); $325 for rows W, X and Y. The cost is per seat and includes all home games.

The savings by purchasing season tickets as opposed to single game tickets is $760 for club; $570 for premium; $456 for general and $380 for rows W, X and Y.

Tickets for 10 and 20-game packages also are available. The 10-game package costs are $110 for rows C through V; and $95 for rows W, X, Y and Z. The 20-game package costs are $320 for club; $175 for premium (rows A and B); $270 for general (rows C through V); $175 in rows W, X, Y and Z in sections 107 through 110.

The seat locations will be placed two weeks prior to the sale of individual games. The cost is per seat.

U.S. Cellular Coliseum, the 6,700-seat home of the PrairieThunder, is located at 101 S. Madison Street, Bloomington. The box office phone number is 309-434-2679 or 1-866-891-9992.


Back »

[qcmallards5]

All that really means is that there will be hockey in Bloomington next year. The Mallards started selling season tickets for next year about a month ago, right around the time when the whole ECHL rumor broke.

[freddypuck]

Ticket sales are irrelevant to which league the team plays in. It keeps the fans going, generates early revenue, and keeps the rumors a bit toned down. Mallards will announce soon that they are joining the ECHL and all season ticket holders who have purchased early bird will have their tickets honored.

More interesting to see will be how the remaining teams shake out... I am sure they will keep as much quiet as possible until the playoffs are over

[Minor League Man]

I thought QC was going AHL myself (Would make more sense, with its close proximity to Rockford, Peoria, Iowa, Omaha)

[sportsguy12]

I thought QC was going AHL myself (Would make more sense, with its close proximity to Rockford, Peoria, Iowa, Omaha)

but it didn't work out. There's only one AHL spot left. The Florida Panthers need a home for their farm team, so we'll have to see ... That's the only option unless they relocate a team.

[qcmallards5]

3,100 fans per game won't get it done in the AHL. That's why for places like Peoria, Omaha and probably Rockford, you almost have to have an owner willing to take a bath in the occasional season in order to stay alive (in Rockford's case, it could be the taxpayers on the hook, as they will be owned by the arena authority).

When the AHL rumors were flying here, the old Mallards owners were saying that to break even, they'd have to average 4,500 per game. That seems a bit high, and it also depends on a lot of other factors (ticket prices, front office expenses, how much your lease costs, etc). I'd guess the break even number could go lower, if you had those other factors working in your favor. I'm almost certain that the bottom 3 or 4 AHL teams lost money this year, maybe more...which is also why the AHL rumors pop up here almost every year - because they have teams struggling, too.

My personal preference is to see a nice, stable (i.e. profitable or at least break-even) franchise that can stay for a long time in the same market. I think the Franke's got it right with the Komets, and I think QC's current owners feel the same way. The ECHL may or may not be a better fit, but I doubt the Mallards go to the ECHL without Bloomington.

[freddypuck]

Rumored that Long Beach (ECHL) wants to move to Chicago next season and only needs the permission of the ECHL

its looking more and more like the U is done at the end of the season. Because Elmira, Rockford, Chicago and QC are leaving or are likely to leave... Couple other teams on the fence. there won't be enough teams left to have a league. 10 teams is minimal for a league... but can anyone imagine 6 or 8 team league?

IHL - Fort Wayne, Kalamazoo, Bloomington, Port Huron, Muskegon and Flint

[Dilbert]

can anyone imagine 6 or 8 team league?



The SPHL is surviving with 7. With Rockford already gone(AHL) and Elmira gone(ECHL) the U is now down to 8.

Kalamazoo, Muskegon, Bloomington, Fort Wayne, and Quad City need to go to the CHL. It would give Youngstown some closer teams. Port Huron and Flint need to fold. Chicago can go to the ECHL to replace Long Beach

[Pounder]

Published story today about Flint having a buyer... and if the deal is finalized, that's LONG overdue.

Thing is, the story is a tentative agreement, with discussions about the sale of Perani Arena yet to get underway. I can see where this negotiation can fall flat... but good luck.

[rams80]

The SPHL is surviving with 7. With Rockford already gone(AHL) and Elmira gone(ECHL) the U is now down to 8.

Kalamazoo, Muskegon, Bloomington, Fort Wayne, and Quad City need to go to the CHL. It would give Youngstown some closer teams. Port Huron and Flint need to fold. Chicago can go to the ECHL to replace Long Beach

I think the UHL teams would take the ECHL over the CHL if those were their only two choices.