SPHL New Teams

[#1 Guard Fan]

Looks like there will be some new teams in the league next year. Now lets just hope that we can keep the teams that we have already.
http://www.thesphl.com/news/?id=2618

[zerotollerance]

I hope you are right! It looks like the Seals have been pulling more fans recently and PD has new owners, but I'm not sure if Jax will stick around next year. Their attendance is weak and their rent is crazy. If Richmond jumps in along with one other team (Pensacola???), a strong eight team league would be nice.

[#1 Guard Fan]

The rumor now is that both current Fl teams will fold. I am glad to see that Pee Dee got a new ownership group and is willing to get the fans back into the game. I am hoping for a 10+ team league next year

[spider]

What about teams in Missouri? I know of a couple of places that would work well for hockey.
What kind of seating caps are they looking at?

[rams80]

What about teams in Missouri? I know of a couple of places that would work well for hockey.
What kind of seating caps are they looking at?

The farthest west you get in this league is Huntsville, AL and Knoxville, TN.

Travel costs alone make any Missouri team a non-starter.

[Mike4FireAntz34]

I hope we get more teams for next year as well .

[#1 Guard Fan]

Yeah this is more of a short bus drive league but that helps teams out with the money side.

[Minor League Man]

Here are my hopes:
VIRGINIA:
Chesapeake
NORTH CAROLINA:
Greensboro
Asheville
Winston-Salem
Kannapolis
SOUTH CAROLINA:
Myrtle Beach
GEORGIA:
Macon
Athens
Savannah
Rome
Albany
ALABAMA:
Birmingham
Mobile
TENNESSEE:
Chattanooga
Memphis
FLORIDA:
Tallahassee
Daytona Beach
Lakeland

[Mike4FireAntz34]

Here are my hopes:
VIRGINIA:
Chesapeake
NORTH CAROLINA:
Greensboro
Asheville
Winston-Salem
Kannapolis
SOUTH CAROLINA:
Myrtle Beach
GEORGIA:
Macon
Athens
Savannah
Rome
Albany
ALABAMA:
Birmingham
Mobile
TENNESSEE:
Chattanooga
Memphis
FLORIDA:
Tallahassee
Daytona Beach
Lakeland

1.The SPHL isnt gonna have Fayetteville left out...
2.The league wont be that size for about 5-10 more years.

[TXBugzFan]

Memphis already has a hockey team, although they play in Northern MS, just outside of Memphis. I don't think the area could support two hockey teams. One, or both, would suffer probably. I could be wrong, but who knows. The Riverkings (or Riverqueens as we like to call them in Bug country) are in the Central Hockey League.

[#1 Guard Fan]

I think that is a wish list of teams plus the current teams we already have

[ytse123]

Originally Posted by Minor League Man
Here are my hopes:
VIRGINIA:
Chesapeake
NORTH CAROLINA:
Greensboro
Asheville
Winston-Salem
Kannapolis
SOUTH CAROLINA:
Myrtle Beach
GEORGIA:
Macon
Athens
Savannah
Rome
Albany
ALABAMA:
Birmingham
Mobile
TENNESSEE:
Chattanooga
Memphis
FLORIDA:
Tallahassee
Daytona Beach
Lakeland

I think that most of those teams are probably not viable.. Asheville and Tallahasee excluded. What you will probably see over the next few years is an exodus from the ECHL due to travel costs. three of the four Carolina teams have to make massive road swings to the California coast this year. Charlotte and Charleston (Stingrays) can probably afford it, Low rent, High attendance. Columbia, Greenville,Augusta and Pensacola are hurting. THe UHL is trying to get out of the south (they have called it a mistake and say that hockey is a fad here.) There are a few other cities looking for teams, but are considered unviable by other leagues.

IMHO: SPHL

Fayetteville
Knoxville
Huntsville
Columbus
Pee-Dee
Jacksonville (may suspend for a year.. but should return quickly)
Asheville(06-07)
Richmond (06-07)
Pensacolla(06-07)
Tallahasee(06-07)
Greenville(07-08)
Roanoke(07-08)
Augusta(07-08)
Baltimore (????)

I mention Baltimore only because they have supported an AHL team before but have been passed over by the UHL and ECHL for teams .. I know personally that there are two ownership groups looking for a league.. it would be contingent on the sphl expanding no further south than Kissimee. if Balt comes in that would put all the teams within a 15 hour bus trip. Not bad.. better if you split them up and limit inter division play. All teams would be far enough away from each other to not draw off each others attendance.

so back to minor leagues list....
Originally Posted by Minor League Man
Here are my hopes:
VIRGINIA:
Chesapeake - Home of the AHL admirals
NORTH CAROLINA:
Greensboro- Major rent issues with arens
Asheville- Brubaker's an idiot but he may be right here
Winston-Salem - If ashville doesn't pan out.. but not both.
Kannapolis - lets see how they do with an aifl team first
SOUTH CAROLINA:
Myrtle Beach - currently pee-dee
GEORGIA:
Macon - the thrashers ut the nail in this coffin
Athens - would follow in macons footprints
Savannah - if augusta just folds albany or savannah may pick up the renains
Rome - see athens
Albany - see savanna
ALABAMA:
Birmingham - Maybe.. but the bulls fell bad. it would take a lot of work
Mobile -arena suffered horrible damage in katrina. may never see light of day again plus Biloxi getting thier team back...
TENNESSEE:
Chattanooga - too close to knoxville
Memphis - CHL team already there...
FLORIDA:
Tallahassee - probably in works
Daytona Beach - Too close to J'ville
Lakeland - Too close to failing KIsimme franchise

Just my opinion.

[#1 Guard Fan]

Well I could sure go for a 10 team league. Hopefully the SPHL can cash in on the other leagues that are letting teams fall off their scope.

[mitchg73]

I think we are looking at an 8-10 team league next season.With the addition of richmond and possisbly roanoke.Richmond looks to be a lock and im thinking jacksonville might jump ship,but kissimme and pee dee are sticking it out.Tallahasee is still possible ,asheville i believe is dead ,pensacola,augusta and greeneville could be future additions if not next season then 07/08.It should be an interesting summer.

[jstaton]

The ECHL former Knoxville Cherokees/Pee Dee Pride, whose franchise is current but who are not playing this year, have stated intentions to open up shop in Myrtle Beach.

[#1 Guard Fan]

Well both of those teams are now in the SPHL so they might follow even if they are in MB next year

[#1 Guard Fan]

Any new news out there. Been dead in here just seeing if anything new is out there???

[adsco]

Looks like Daytona Beach, and Richmond will be in next year. Assuming the UHL pulls out of Richmond, that a propective owner already has his application in for that location.

Pee Dee is completely revisited, has a new owner and a new budget, and a strong marketing campaign for "group sales" next year.

The two Florida teams, also, have revised their budgets, trimmed some fat off them, and also are revamping their marketing stategy.

Too most people, surviving on attendence of 1,500 people - would seem imposible; but not when you consider the "low cost" of doing business in the SPHL.

Firstly, the distance to travel in the SPHL is small, and at a cost $2.50 per mile for a motor coach - it can add up. Also many of the teams have only about a 11 or 12 overnighters, which also helps cut costs.

An SPHL team can survive on attendence of 1,500 when the salary cap is adhered to, and there is good Corporate sponsership.

Often times Corporations will make large group purchases; but not attend. Some teams announce big attendence; but they've given the tickets away, or sold them cheap. So attendence isn't always the best way to measure a team's economic stability.

And, we never know what kind of deal the team has - with the Arena.

The SPHL is not likely to expand past 12 teams. This makes it a good investment for prospective investors. Travel and costs will be kept to a minimum. Value will be built into the franchises as a consequence.

Perhaps the SPHL will start using younger players. Top Canadian, US and European Junior stars - this will make it a faster more entertaining brand of Hockey, and also cheaper too, as for example, top Canadian Junior players only get "room and board" and in some instances a "University deal" for when they quit playing. However, it is usually only NHL "can't miss" prospects, that get the deal.

So to get "room and board" a daily "per diem", and a couple hundred a week isn't too bad a deal for a 16, 17, or 18 year old Hockey player. And, they generally play with a lot more enthuisasm than an older guy that has kicked around the Cent' UHL or ECHL, for five or ten years, and is sick and tired of being in a bus for 2 1/2 months per year, sleeping over seats, and eating rotten food.

Don't forget that a lot would prefer to play in a League with a warm climate. It beats traveling for weeks on end, all over cold ravished Western Canada, Ontario, Quebec and points east! As best as I can remember young guys like scantily clad chics in bikinis, and I don't think ya see many of them on the long bus rides through wintery Canada.

All in all, look for the SPHL to prosper in the next few years.

[#1 Guard Fan]

Great post. I think you had some good points in there. I do think over the next two years you will see the SPHL grow past 12 teams. I would say the SPHL will have 10 teams next year with more cities looking to jump in the league come 2008. The teams that are in the league now have gotten a some what solid base under them. I look for the old teams in Macon and Ashville to show back up next year. Not sure if I agree 100% about the younger palyers making it better. I think that might add more issues you would have to worry about KIDS being on the team and in the league. Come on just think about when you were 16,17 and 18

[adsco]

The mandate of the league is to have 12 teams only. That is the one of the selling points that the expansion committe is making; but I guess anything is possible.

When I was 16, 17, 18 - I was only 160 lbs. I would be surprised if anyone in Major Junior Hockey in Canada is less than that. In fact I would bet that most are 200 lbs. In the WHL, I hear these "kids" are on road trips for up to three weeks. I think that tends to seperate the men from the boys.

You may have a point; but you may also underestimate the skill levels of CHL (Major Junior) players. I know an older guy who just retired from the AHL last year. He played in every league there was in North America, and he said the teams always go for Major Junior players because they "are more proffesional".

I see a lot of guys in the Cent' and SPHL that played "Provincial Jr. A", and no disrespect to them, but frankly it isn't really a fair comparison. I've heard that the Alberta, and Saskatchewan Provincial Jr. is better than Ontario's but I don't know for sure. In essence, an 17-18 year old out of Major Junior is going to be quite a bit better than a 21 year old out of Provincial Jr. A.

It is just my opinion; but I think that if the SPHL had an age limit of 23-25, and reduced the cap a bit, and got better refs - they would be better recieved.

[F_CSM]

I'm sorry, did somebody say that the SPHL would be around for another 5-10 years?

"Excuse me, waiter? I'll have what he's having."

[adsco]

The SPHL has a far more feasible budget then the UHL, ECHL, and Central League. In fact you will probably see teams from those leagues join the SPHL.

[KLM Line]

It was mentioned that Chattanooga is too close to Knoxville to be a viable SPHL option.

Having discussed this with some persons in the organization, they would LOVE to have a team in Chattanooga however there is really no place to play.

The places that exist in Chattanooga don't have facilities for an ice surface. In addtion, the success of some of the SPHL teams has been due to the thrifty management of money and they don't have the cash to install a chiller system in an existing facitlity.

Thus no Chattanooga team in the near future. It's the facility, not the location.

[#1 Guard Fan]

Well I talked with some richmond fans at our home game Sat night and they said they were a lock for the SPHL next year. Thye have been hearing that some other VA teams might try and come over to the SPHL to help out with overall cost.

[rams80]

The SPHL has a far more feasible budget then the UHL, ECHL, and Central League. In fact you will probably see teams from those leagues join the SPHL.

Ok, now we're starting to veer back into drug induced fantasies and hallucinations. What CHL team is close enough to the SPHL to make a go of it? Besides Richmond and Roanoke, what UHL teams could hack the travel? ECHL teams dropping down?-the "success" of Pee Dee kind of shoots a hole in that theory.

[#1 Guard Fan]

Well we will have to wait and see what teams do what in the off season. I think we will see some teams from other leagues in the SPHL next year. I am not saying what league is better than the other. I think the SPHL is pretty soild for a minor league system.

[Minor League Man]

It was mentioned that Chattanooga is too close to Knoxville to be a viable SPHL option.

Having discussed this with some persons in the organization, they would LOVE to have a team in Chattanooga however there is really no place to play.

The places that exist in Chattanooga don't have facilities for an ice surface. In addtion, the success of some of the SPHL teams has been due to the thrifty management of money and they don't have the cash to install a chiller system in an existing facitlity.

Thus no Chattanooga team in the near future. It's the facility, not the location.
Hello, Camp Jordan Arena?

[rams80]

Hello, Camp Jordan Arena?

You need to have an icemaker in addition to having a barn (and I believe the place is literally a barn).

[mitchg73]

Ok, now we're starting to veer back into drug induced fantasies and hallucinations. What CHL team is close enough to the SPHL to make a go of it? Besides Richmond and Roanoke, what UHL teams could hack the travel? ECHL teams dropping down?-the "success" of Pee Dee kind of shoots a hole in that theory.
i think we might see a few teams come around in the 07-08 season like some SC teams....nothing against pee dee but when they in the echl they were only avergaing about 2,000 a game,so not a big drop there..i think with the new local ownership and a good marketing plan they'll be ok...in the future i think greeneville,augusta pensacola and maybe columbia may drop to the sphl.. i dont think you'll see any chl teams defect with the exception of maybe memphis but i dont think that'll happen

[#1 Guard Fan]

I think the longer the SPHL can stand stronge the more you will see other teams look to this league.

[KLM Line]

You need to have an icemaker in addition to having a barn (and I believe the place is literally a barn).

That was my point. There might be places that could hold a hockey rink, but there isn't one that has everything nescesarry already in place, which is what SPHL teams need, as they are not able to spring for a new system and the renovation to an existing facility.

[adsco]

Ok, now we're starting to veer back into drug induced fantasies and hallucinations. What CHL team is close enough to the SPHL to make a go of it? Besides Richmond and Roanoke, what UHL teams could hack the travel? ECHL teams dropping down?-the "success" of Pee Dee kind of shoots a hole in that theory.

Pee Dee was "mismanaged"! And, what teams could hack the travel beside Ronake, and Richmond? None. The SPHL won't allow them in if they are not in a feasible traveling distance. Minor Pro hockey seldom works if it is not promoted - you don't just announce that you have a team and open the doors, and expect it to work.

And, by the way Augusta is in the ECHL.

Also, most guys that are put in charge of teams, might know Hockey; but not business. This is why there are so many failures. Check out some research on the Birmingham Bulls (CHL amd ECHL), and other teams, its the same old story almost everytime. The "absentee" owner is also a good one!

Kind of strong language for "friendly message board" isn't it? Check the facts next time 'ole buddy.

[rams80]

Well I'm confused now.

Seriously, what did I say that was not factual?

[#1 Guard Fan]

There is no telling on this place

[dgjordan]

The rumor now is that both current Fl teams will fold. I am glad to see that Pee Dee got a new ownership group and is willing to get the fans back into the game. I am hoping for a 10+ team league next year
Oh please, please, please, tell me that this is just a rumor! I can't go on without hockey in Central Florida.........

[#1 Guard Fan]

Like I said it was a rumor. Hopefully they will still be around next year. I have heard Daytona Beach might be coming to the SPHL next year too. That would be great to have 3 Fl teams maybe that would help better with a fan base having three teams to compete interstate

[dgjordan]

Like I said it was a rumor. Hopefully they will still be around next year. I have heard Daytona Beach might be coming to the SPHL next year too. That would be great to have 3 Fl teams maybe that would help better with a fan base having three teams to compete interstate
yes, but there is always some truth to every rumor - hopefully not this one!

Just listened to the Seals broadcast. Perhaps there WILL be a team in DB sometime soon!

Have you heard any more on the VA team(s) hopefully coming to SPHL?

[Mike4FireAntz34]

I think Richmond is getting a team next year.

[rams80]

Oh please, please, please, tell me that this is just a rumor! I can't go on without hockey in Central Florida.........

Count heads next time you're in the arena. If around 2000 or less, the team's in trouble.

[ytse123]

Ok, now we're starting to veer back into drug induced fantasies and hallucinations. What CHL team is close enough to the SPHL to make a go of it? Besides Richmond and Roanoke, what UHL teams could hack the travel? ECHL teams dropping down?-the "success" of Pee Dee kind of shoots a hole in that theory.

Does anyone remember the IHL .. you know the minor league that became so bloated and travel costly to survive? I believe it had teams in arizona, west canada, california, florida, texas mdwest and northeast....sound familiar?

[ytse123]

Have you heard any more on the VA team(s) hopefully coming to SPHL?


Richmond is a lock.. all the staff of the UHL team has moved to chicago.. leaving a skeleton crew... and the old ECHL owner of the Renegades has been granted a SPHL franchise. He has been showing up at all the Riverdogs games with a Renegades and SPHL pin on his lapel.

[adsco]

Like I said it was a rumor. Hopefully they will still be around next year. I have heard Daytona Beach might be coming to the SPHL next year too. That would be great to have 3 Fl teams maybe that would help better with a fan base having three teams to compete interstate

I have it on good authority that Richmond will be in, as long as the UTL moves out.

Unfortunetely, the Arena rental rate is not that good in Richmond. Until these guys (new owners) realize that they won't make a go of it unless they are paying .50 cents a head to the arena for attendence, and get a kick back for big crowds (ie: free rent for sell outs and big crowds) and free practise ice - they aren't going to make it. If you don't have a business plan that allows you to break even with 1,500 average attendence, your pissing in the wind.

Daytona is in for sure in 2008-2009; but possibly next year. The owner may run the team out of the Ice Palace, as the Daytona Beach Convention Center hasn't built the areana yet, or is presently overbooked and they need to do renovations in order to accomadate the team.

As best as I understand it: you would have to pack fans in to the Ice Palace like sardines, and it would be, "mostly standing room" only, to get 600-1000 fans in.

Playing in the Ice Palace, in my view, is a bad idea: it will give prospective players, and fans a "mickey mouse perception" of the team and league.

I wish the new owners luck though!

With the salary cap, and reduced travel in the SPHL, I think it will eventually rival the other AA leagues both in stability, and level of play.

GO SPHL!

[mitchg73]

I have it on good authority that Richmond will be in, as long as the UTL moves out.

Unfortunetely, the Arena rental rate is not that good in Richmond. Until these guys (new owners) realize that they won't make a go of it unless they are paying .50 cents a head to the arena for attendence, and get a kick back for big crowds (ie: free rent for sell outs and big crowds) and free practise ice - they aren't going to make it. If you don't have a business plan that allows you to break even with 1,500 average attendence, your pissing in the wind.

Daytona is in for sure in 2008-2009; but possibly next year. The owner may run the team out of the Ice Palace, as the Daytona Beach Convention Center hasn't built the areana yet, or is presently overbooked and they need to do renovations in order to accomadate the team.

As best as I understand it: you would have to pack fans in to the Ice Palace like sardines, and it would be, "mostly standing room" only, to get 600-1000 fans in.

Playing in the Ice Palace, in my view, is a bad idea: it will give prospective players, and fans a "mickey mouse perception" of the team and league.

I wish the new owners luck though!

With the salary cap, and reduced travel in the SPHL, I think it will eventually rival the other AA leagues both in stability, and level of play.

GO SPHL!
richmond should be a sure thing....daytona wont happen i wish macon or lakeland city members would come around if not no teams there

[Mike4FireAntz34]

Macon would be great for the SPHL but I think they are in a different league.

[#1 Guard Fan]

I have heard rumors that Macon may be back in the SPHL next year. Time will tell

[KLM Line]

The Va team has drifted from about a 75% certainty to about a 90% certainty. Perhaps higher. Keep in mind that until they start skating nothing is certain, however things are going well. Lets just say that the powers that be think it's going to happen and they are working based on that assumption.

Regarding an earlier comment by someone; (I think it was RAMS) putting 1500 fannies in the seats generally will not allow even an SPHL team to break even, even if the organization is being well managed. By that I mean a team that has a full-time front office staff consisting of more than 1 or 2 full time employees. Excluding Pee Dee which has had so much staffing drama this year, it generally takes between 1800 and 2200 persons to break even, depending on the number of paid staff, etc. I realize that is a wide range, but there are so many variables.

Many of the teams will give you a rough idea as to what thier annual budget is and what they need to break even if you ever get a chance to sit down with a staffer. From those I have talked to, I am guesstimating that $750,000 would be a median number for a normal year of operations. (Not a startup year) Anyone have any more info on that?

If a team enters things with a feasible plan, the SPHL is a very do-able hockey business, but the plan must be sound and there must be a business person as well as a hockey person involved. To emphasize that point, go back and list the SPHL cites that have had teams fail (often repeatedly)in other leagues.(generally more expensive ones)

The CHL and ECHL keep popping up on here. There are teams in those leagues that make good money. There are also some teams in those leagues that would kill to be in the SPHL financial model as opposed to the one they are in. In all honesty, the SPHL model makes more sense in many, if not most cases, which is why you are MUCH more likely to see teams (especially those in small ECHL/CHL markets) drift down as opposed to seeing teams from the SPHL set their sights on the ECHL. Keep in mind, however that part of that sound plan is to eliminate eternal bus trips and massive mileage. That will in fact keep the SPHL "Southern" Don't expect teams from too far away.

I continue to enjoy all the posts. Keep it up... tell a friend.
Dave

[#1 Guard Fan]

Well hopefully we will get a couple more teams this off season. I was hoping for a two divison league next year. We also need more teams in the league to stop a team with less than 20 wins making the playoffs. Come on help us out here

[Mike4FireAntz34]

Well hopefully we will get a couple more teams this off season. I was hoping for a two divison league next year. We also need more teams in the league to stop a team with less than 20 wins making the playoffs. Come on help us out here

If they add 2 or 3 teams ...teams with less than 20 wins wont get in the playoffs.

[#1 Guard Fan]

My whole point. If we have 10 or more teams we could have 2 divisions with the top 3 in each making the playoffs. I think that would cut out the teams with less then 20 wins. Plus 10 teams would be so great because they would still be in driving distance for the fams and thats grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrreat

[adsco]

The Va team has drifted from about a 75% certainty to about a 90% certainty. Perhaps higher. Keep in mind that until they start skating nothing is certain, however things are going well. Lets just say that the powers that be think it's going to happen and they are working based on that assumption.

Regarding an earlier comment by someone; (I think it was RAMS) putting 1500 fannies in the seats generally will not allow even an SPHL team to break even, even if the organization is being well managed. By that I mean a team that has a full-time front office staff consisting of more than 1 or 2 full time employees. Excluding Pee Dee which has had so much staffing drama this year, it generally takes between 1800 and 2200 persons to break even, depending on the number of paid staff, etc. I realize that is a wide range, but there are so many variables.

Many of the teams will give you a rough idea as to what thier annual budget is and what they need to break even if you ever get a chance to sit down with a staffer. From those I have talked to, I am guesstimating that $750,000 would be a median number for a normal year of operations. (Not a startup year) Anyone have any more info on that?

If a team enters things with a feasible plan, the SPHL is a very do-able hockey business, but the plan must be sound and there must be a business person as well as a hockey person involved. To emphasize that point, go back and list the SPHL cites that have had teams fail (often repeatedly)in other leagues.(generally more expensive ones)

The CHL and ECHL keep popping up on here. There are teams in those leagues that make good money. There are also some teams in those leagues that would kill to be in the SPHL financial model as opposed to the one they are in. In all honesty, the SPHL model makes more sense in many, if not most cases, which is why you are MUCH more likely to see teams (especially those in small ECHL/CHL markets) drift down as opposed to seeing teams from the SPHL set their sights on the ECHL. Keep in mind, however that part of that sound plan is to eliminate eternal bus trips and massive mileage. That will in fact keep the SPHL "Southern" Don't expect teams from too far away.

I continue to enjoy all the posts. Keep it up... tell a friend.
Dave

I think most of the points you are making are quite good; but many arenas already have sales staff on hand to sell tickets for you on a "commission basis". Therefore it possible to operate on a budget of about 450-500K, (franchise fee excluded) assuming you have a favourable lease arrangement, and sales staff already in place.

You will incurr a 250K expenditure, before you even drop the puck, as there are many expenditures to be made "up front".

Also you don't neccassarily have to have a full time business person "on hand full time". So essentially, you can go with one full time coach, and a part time trainer, and a part time business person.

Often times your rent is based on full attendance at about .50 cents per seat. So if you've got an arena that holds 10,000 people and your only getting 2,200 you are behind the eight ball right off. Ideally, you don't really want or need an arena that holds more than 3,500 to 5,000 for an SPHL team.

According to my research there are approx. 2 areanas in the SPHL area that fill that bill. Responses invited: i381243@yahoo.ca

[#1 Guard Fan]

Ok care to share what to arena's you are talking about?

[flpadiinstructor]

As a very famous person once said: "the rumors of my death have been GREATLY EXAGERATED"!

The Florida Seals are not letting you off the hook that easily. They are already renegotiating for their next season with the Silver Spurs Arena and only need to have the new teams and schedules to finalize next season.

Our new owner was very pleased with the BUTTS IN THE SEATS and WHEN we bring the cup home in our first season in our new arena, it will only boost our attendence for next year as well.

As for Jax, we may agree that it doesn't look good for them, but their rent is actually justified as they have a BEAUTIFUL HOCKEY arena. It deserves the higher rent, unfortunately for Jax, they just can't get the butts in the seats.

Could have to do with the dozen different goalies and new players each week of the season and just barely enough players left to complete the season.

If they don't find a way to stop the turnover of people, they can't expect fans to come and back a team when they don't even know who will be there from one week to the next.

At the final game of the season, they only showed up in Kissimmee with 11 players and once again at least 3 new ones.

It was a pitiful excuse for a team. They literally played like they had to be there and they weren't doing any more than was required to complete the season.

And this in front of about 100 of their fans who drove down for the last game.

I felt sorry for their fans who wasted the trip for that performance.

PITIFUL is the only way to describe their last game!!!

GO TERRY DENIKE and the FLORIDA SEALS!!!

We will see you PISSANTS on Sat to claim our first round win in person!!!

[#1 Guard Fan]

Well we will be out ealry before the game tail gating and having some beer before the game. I think tonight's game will be the tone for the series between us and the Seals. Lets the bodies hit the floor.....I meant the puck

[dgjordan]

Count heads next time you're in the arena. If around 2000 or less, the team's in trouble.

Yes, we count heads at every game, and are quite worried; however, it seems like attendance IS picking up. Go Seals!

[dgjordan]

Does anyone remember the IHL .. you know the minor league that became so bloated and travel costly to survive? I believe it had teams in arizona, west canada, california, florida, texas mdwest and northeast....sound familiar?

Yes, remember the IHL. Been a victim of the IHL, and then the ACHL, and then the WHA2...Hoping not to be a victim of the SPHL.

[dgjordan]

As a very famous person once said: "the rumors of my death have been GREATLY EXAGERATED"!

The Florida Seals are not letting you off the hook that easily. They are already renegotiating for their next season with the Silver Spurs Arena and only need to have the new teams and schedules to finalize next season.

Our new owner was very pleased with the BUTTS IN THE SEATS and WHEN we bring the cup home in our first season in our new arena, it will only boost our attendence for next year as well.

As for Jax, we may agree that it doesn't look good for them, but their rent is actually justified as they have a BEAUTIFUL HOCKEY arena. It deserves the higher rent, unfortunately for Jax, they just can't get the butts in the seats.

Could have to do with the dozen different goalies and new players each week of the season and just barely enough players left to complete the season.

If they don't find a way to stop the turnover of people, they can't expect fans to come and back a team when they don't even know who will be there from one week to the next.

At the final game of the season, they only showed up in Kissimmee with 11 players and once again at least 3 new ones.

It was a pitiful excuse for a team. They literally played like they had to be there and they weren't doing any more than was required to complete the season.

And this in front of about 100 of their fans who drove down for the last game.

I felt sorry for their fans who wasted the trip for that performance.

PITIFUL is the only way to describe their last game!!!

GO TERRY DENIKE and the FLORIDA SEALS!!!

We will see you PISSANTS on Sat to claim our first round win in person!!!

You forgot to mention that the 11 person team showed up without their head coach. Heard from a JAX fan that he is now the ex-coach of the Barracudas. It's unbelievable that they went from first to worst in just two years.

[#1 Guard Fan]

Lets hope they can turn things around and be back in the league next year

[richmondhockey]

richmond renegades
colors blue and yellow
pirate mascot
the uhl team owner called the coach and told him not to use #1 gooltender so we would lose and not make the playoffs. did not want to spend the money

[Jaxen]

Some stuff I've gleaned from talking to 2 SPHL Directors of PR/Media Relations ...

Richmond is a veritable lock for '06-07. If so SPHL will go with 8 next season and a two division format. (SO TALK OF ANY OTHER TEAMS IS TABLED FOR '06-07)

Roanoke has 1 more year left on their UHL contract, after that finishes they could be a possibility. At that time, if another team comes with them to make a 10-team SPHL in '07-08, leading candidates would be Pensacola or Augusta.

Daytona Beach ... not happening next year. And since this is minor-league hockey, it's silly to talk 2 years ahead.

Florida Seals ... they have a three-year lease at the Silver Spurs. Yes they lost some money this year, but they have deep-pockets in ownership that can absorb it (and claim it as a business loss on taxes) and will be 1 of the 8 next season. Jacksonville will also be one of the 8, they are doing a massive overhaul of coaching and front office after this year's painful debacle.

[#1 Guard Fan]

I guess it is always to see teams added and no teams dropping out. I guess I had higher hopes for more teams next year. I will be happy with 8 and looking for more teams in the years to come

[osopa506]

Jaxen...dont forget the seals got a large sum of money in the settlement with the city of orlando and their lease...that should help in the finance areas for the florida seals team.

[osopa506]

Well now that Richmond is in and this pushes the teams to eight...what does that mean for next season?

The way I would like to see it...

2 divisions of 4

North- Richmond, Knoxville, Fayetteville, Huntsville
South- Pee Dee, Jax, Florida, Columbus

(Huntsville and Pee Dee could be opposite)

Playoffs...Top three teams in each get in...bottom team each division is out.

Teams 2 and 3 in each division play each other in 5 game series with top team in each division getting a bye...

2nd round is winner of each division against the top team in each division in 7 game series...

Finals...Winners of each division in a 7 game series...


Other thoughts/ideas?

[pcc]

i think they should put all of the teams in one division and have the top 4 teams make the playoffs

[R-Dizzle804]

I like the idea of keeping one division of eight, but with the top 6 teams getting in. This would give the top 2 teams a bye with seeds 3 and 6 playing each other and 4 and 5 playing each other in a best of 5 series. For the semis re-seed with the 1 seed playin the lowest remaining seed and the 2 seed gettin the highest remaining seed in a best of 7. the championship wouls also b best of 7.

[Mike4FireAntz34]

Well now that Richmond is in and this pushes the teams to eight...what does that mean for next season?

The way I would like to see it...

2 divisions of 4

North- Richmond, Knoxville, Fayetteville, Huntsville
South- Pee Dee, Jax, Florida, Columbus

(Huntsville and Pee Dee could be opposite)

Playoffs...Top three teams in each get in...bottom team each division is out.

Teams 2 and 3 in each division play each other in 5 game series with top team in each division getting a bye...

2nd round is winner of each division against the top team in each division in 7 game series...

Finals...Winners of each division in a 7 game series...


Other thoughts/ideas?

You messed up a little

North- Richmond, Knoxville, Fayetteville, Pee Dee
South- Huntsville, Jax, Florida, Columbus

There that is more like it.

[osopa506]

You messed up a little

North- Richmond, Knoxville, Fayetteville, Pee Dee
South- Huntsville, Jax, Florida, Columbus

There that is more like it.



thats why i said after my list

"(Huntsville and Pee Dee could be opposite)"

they are both equal about north/south

i guess it would be what close cities they want to try and keep together...

huntsville/knoxville or pee dee/fayetteville

[KLM Line]

I was just perusing the list of teams in each division.

Unless I am mistaken that will mean that the other teams in Knoxville's division are a combined 1-14 in thier last 15 games against the Icebears in Knoxville. Of course we have no idea how the Renegades will perform in Knoxville, but the teams that have given Knoxville the most trouble have been moved to the other division.

Anyone know how the scheduling will work? Are they planning on playing the divisional teams more often than the teams in the other division? If so, the South will be BRUTAL.

In addition, Knoxville's biggest rivals (Huntsville and Columbus) are both in the other division. The icebears are indeed one of the best teams (if not THE best team) over the last two years, however they have also benifited from a favorable home schedule and a playoff format that favored them. (Granted they had to WIN the regular season championship to be in that position)

Knoxville's lineup will be vastly different next season compared to this one, however if nothing else, Knoxville has proven they gladly accept favorable scheduling. This definately won't hurt.

[Guardfan3]

Anyone know how the scheduling will work? Are they planning on playing the divisional teams more often than the teams in the other division? If so, the South will be BRUTAL.


Right now, I don't think they're planning anything, and I don't think they know how the schedule will work. I don't think they have had their summer meetings yet, and they still need to get dates and tentative availability from all arenas.

As for the 1-14 record, that may have been significant a month ago, but right now, it means nothing. Come October, we start a new season, with all records being 0-0. I am sure that a few returning players from each team will remember how their team fared against Knox last season, and for a few of them, it might be something they will have to overcome. But I don't think it will be that important in deciding the games, regardless of how the teams are separated--if at all--into divisions.

[Minor League Man]

I'd like to see more real south.

you know,

Daytona Beach, Lakeland, Tallahassee, Birmingham, Mobile, et al.

[#1 Guard Fan]

I would love to see the true south deal too. I was hoping that Macon would come back into the league this year. If we had a true south group like you called it we might be able to pull off a three div league then.
South
Jax
Florida
D Beach??
Lakeland??
Pensacola??


Central
Huntsville
Columbus
Pee Dee
Macon??
Augusta??

North-
Richmond
Knoxville
Fayetteville
Roanoke??
Ashville??
Now I think that would be a good set up. I don't think we will see this for many years if ever but a fan can wish right?

[macon_fan]

Does Anyone Out There See Macon As Having Even A Small Chance Of Getting A Team Back In The Sphl? I Know It Would Be Tough But A Lot Of Us Had A Blast When The Trax Were Here

[SealsFan1167]

Hey does anyone know when they are going to introduce the new teams of pensicola and daytona? I was talking to the Seals staff and they said that the sphl had to wait on daytona, richmond and pensicola to join the league before they could renew season tickets. I don't think macon will rejoin the sphl. When the Seals joined the league I sat and talk to one of the macon owners. He was one of the minor owners of the seals he said. Maybe if another owner came along there might be a new team in macon.

[#1 Guard Fan]

I have been told that the only new team for this year would be Richmond. The other teams would not join until the following year. I would love to have two more teams for next season. Maybe they have some new news down there that has not made it out to the rest of us yet

[macon_fan]

Well I Hope Macon Gets A Team In The Future. It Would Take A Dedicated Owner(s) With A Lot Of Patience. Hockey Is A Hard Sell Here But It Was Great While It Lasted. It Wouldnt Hurt To Have The Extra Time To Market The Team And Players Even If They Did Join An Another Year.

[#1 Guard Fan]

I would love to see Macon back in the league. I think the team could and would work again down there. I think you just have to have a solid ownership for the team

[SealsFan1167]

I have been told that the only new team for this year would be Richmond. The other teams would not join until the following year. I would love to have two more teams for next season. Maybe they have some new news down there that has not made it out to the rest of us yet
I was standing in the will call line at the last playoff game and behind me where some people from the daytona tema with players talking about coming to see the league and talking about joining the league. That is what I heard maybe your right.

[#1 Guard Fan]

I guess time will tell about if we get any other new teams this year. I would think if anymore teams are going to join it would happen really soon.

[BCRantzilla]

Well I Hope Macon Gets A Team In The Future. It Would Take A Dedicated Owner(s) With A Lot Of Patience. Hockey Is A Hard Sell Here But It Was Great While It Lasted. It Wouldnt Hurt To Have The Extra Time To Market The Team And Players Even If They Did Join An Another Year.

That eliminates David Waronker, (always looking to own multiple teams as history has shown.)

[macon_fan]

So true BC!!! The last year Macon was here it looked like the team might have had a place to call home for the future. Then he pulled the plug and left us hanging. Apparently he wasnt making enough money. Anyone who brings a team to Macon will have to realize it will take some time.

[SealsFan1167]

The last year of the macon team David Waronker was spending a lot of money in the silver spurs to get a team down here. He paid for everything that involved ice down here, and he siad that they could not find local investors to keep the team in macon. I also think that he got tired of trying to keep two teams running.

[BCRantzilla]

The last year of the macon team David Waronker was spending a lot of money in the silver spurs to get a team down here. He paid for everything that involved ice down here, and he siad that they could not find local investors to keep the team in macon. I also think that he got tired of trying to keep two teams running.

Waronker also ran the Asheville team into the ground after singlehandedly drove the rent to NHL levels. What was his excuse then?

I don't buy the Macon story for a second because he has been so fly by night so many times elsewhere. Claiming there are no buyers is a quick and easy way to skip town after you've worn out your welcome.

[SealsFan1167]

All that I am saying was what was posted on the seals website. He said that was the rent that Asheville city gave them that lease with out negotiating a more reasonable lease. He seems not to be running the team into the ground here. He is building things for the better here.

[BCRantzilla]

All that I am saying was what was posted on the seals website. He said that was the rent that Asheville city gave them that lease with out negotiating a more reasonable lease. He seems not to be running the team into the ground here. He is building things for the better here.

Of course EVERYTHING Waronker says is totally on the level right?

I guess you are too young to remember the WHA2/SEHL turf war that Waronker pulled a couple of years ago. This incident is what killed Asheville. He constantly offered to pay more money for the arena until he got his lease killing the SEHL Asheville franchise. After that he ran the team in such a haphazzard manner, (the "get sloshed with the Aces promotion anyone?) that the team died a predictable death. Ask WNCSport about that one as he had the inside track. http://www.wncsport.com .

Waronker has been anything but a good thing for the SPHL and they will only legitimately thrive when he's gone.

[SealsFan1167]

I was around when the wha2 in orlando, but when the aces joined the sphl. The seals were kicked out of the TD Waterhouse and we were in limbo. So I did not know all that went on realy that year and we did not get any news from there in ashville. Things change, Waronker can change. I can remember when he had the seals in orlando and owned three other teams and could not afford to pay the seals players and staff. The staff walked out and the players threatend to do the same if they did not get payed before every game. He has seemed to change since then. That is all I am saying. If you have beef with him that is your problem.

[BCRantzilla]

Nobody who has caused so much havok in the last 5 years gets the benefit of the doubt. Go to 4hockeyfans.com and you will see people in the Orlando area who out and out refuse to ever support a team in the area that DW is associated with. (His treatment of the booster club during the WHA2 Seals era was legendary.) Add this to the fact that he is not welcome in any other arena in the area for misdealings and constant incompetance.

When the remaining SPHL owners let him stay it opened another Pandora's Box that almost completely sunk the league in 04-05. The fact that he didn't have controlling interest in anymore than one team alone kept things drama free this year.

You will notice a pattern, when Waronker has more teams than the rest of the owners, he destroys the whole thing. When he doesn't, things run a bit more smoothly. This is the mark of a sporting cancer, not a person who is good for the game or the communities where he places teams.

[pcc]

sounds to me that waronker had trouble trying to run more then one team, but when he has all of his attention on only one he dosnt do that bad of a job

[#1 Guard Fan]

Ok so back to the main topic NEW TEAMS

[TheHulk]

If Pensacola gets a team it would be the Pensacola Ice Pilots of the ECHL moving down. Then again I do have some prime beach front real estate in Arizona I can sell you too. Tallahassee is the better fit for the SPHL. WHA2 tried to get into the Tallahassee-Leon County CC, but couldn't reach an agreement. Tallahasse was a great hockey town when the Tiger Sharks were around...too bad their owners couldn't play by the rules and got punted out of the ECHL. College towns are great minor league hockey towns if it's promoted correctly.

[SealsFan1167]

During this season for the seals we had a big group of college kids come to the game. They sat right nest to me. They were great guys. A lot of them came during beer night. If the sphl gets a team in Tallahassee they have FSU is right there. The team will get big support.

[#1 Guard Fan]

Well maybe they can get a team down there next year. I really don't see a team going in down there this year.

[SealsFan1167]

Saterday I went to the watch party hosted by the seals and I was talking to them, and they said that there will be only eight teams in the league this year. We will have to wait until next year to see who joins.

[#1 Guard Fan]

I figured the league was already locked at 8 teams this year. I look for a few more teams next year. I mean Roanoke will be in the SPHL next year and maybe a few more Fl teams. Don't be shocked to see Wiston Salem and Macon back next year

[macon_fan]

Rumor has it that there was an owner ready to have a team in Macon but that the hold-up was that our great Centreplex wouldnt give up enough weekend dates for hockey. Hopefully somebody will work this thing out!!!

[F_CSM]

The whispers around Central Florida are that a certain set of brothers, whose name rhymes with Wesposito, have been scouting the building in Lakeland, FL for a new team in a yet to be determined league. I've ben told by an "insider" that the pair has made 5 or 6 trips to look at the facitly. Possibly ECHL, SPHL, and mention has even been made of the AHL. Promises to purchase brand new boards, glass, netting and upgrade the ice plant have been heard faintly thoughtout the Lakeland Center.

Where its all but too late for anything to happen this season in any league, don't be suprised if they make some noise next year.

Then again, don't be suprised if they don't.

[SealsFan1167]

Are you talking about them moving the Florida team moving? I was at the fan club meeting and we were told no, but it would be nice to have a team in daytona and lakeland

[F_CSM]

I got the impression that this would be a new team.

[puckbuster]

I figured the league was already locked at 8 teams this year. I look for a few more teams next year. I mean Roanoke will be in the SPHL next year and maybe a few more Fl teams. Don't be shocked to see Wiston Salem and Macon back next year
As much as I would love to see Roanoke in the SPHL, I think it will take dedicated respected local ownership, and an Infinately better lease than the Vipers had.

[R-Dizzle804]

I agree completely. From the conversations ive had with people in the Valley, im under the impression that there wont be hockey there for the next few years.

[uvaviper]

I've heard so many rumors that Roanoke is in next year is it true?

[R-Dizzle804]

As a Richmonder, id love to see Roanoke land an SPHL franchise.....but like i said above, the UHL team was so poorly run that hockey fans in the Valley are fed up with bad owners and it'll def take a few years b4 u see any kinda hockey in Roanoke again

[canuck steve]

The Southern League seems to be on an upswing,heres my take for next for next year.Pee Dee has to be moved either Greenville or Macon would be ideal,with the other city getting an expansion franchise, and i t would make sense for Pensacola and Augusta to leave the ECHL and join up with the SHL.

[rams80]

I am not in favor of any "expansion" that deprives a perfectly good market for hockey.

As for Pensacola and Augusta, they seem stable enough to me in the ECHL as opposed to risking fans bailing over lower quality hockey.

[sportsguy12]

right where they are in the ECHL. The SPHL might be on the upswing, but it doesn't have the history that the ECHL has. Pee Dee belongs back in the ECHL. I think they'll move back if Myrtle Beach ever comes to fruition. Pensacola does need some more Florida opponents ... maybe Gulf Coast could get their arena done and Mississippi will be returning in 08 to provide a Southernly neighbor.

Macon has tried and failed time and time again, so I think they need a break. Both the ECHL and SPHL have tried and failed. Give it a rest there!

[canuck steve]

Its not a question of history,but more of economics and rivalaries, both Pensacola and Augusta and to a certain extent Columbia are in the bottom third of attendance of the ECHL. Long road trips to Toledo and California must take a huge drain on operating expenses for these teams, it just makes better sense to play in SPHL.Is it better to lose money and see teams fold or is better that these teams can survive in a league with the attendence figures these teams generate. Do not feel sorry for the ECHL, Greensboro,Mrtyle Beach,Mississippi and possibly Norfolk joining them next year.

[rams80]

Its not a question of history,but more of economics and rivalaries, both Pensacola and Augusta and to a certain extent Columbia are in the bottom third of attendance of the ECHL. Long road trips to Toledo and California must take a huge drain on operating expenses for these teams, it just makes better sense to play in SPHL.Is it better to lose money and see teams fold or is better that these teams can survive in a league with the attendence figures these teams generate. Do not feel sorry for the ECHL, Greensboro,Mrtyle Beach,Mississippi and possibly Norfolk joining them next year.

If that's the case why again should Augusta and Pensacola leave? Both teams have been able to handle such costs for years (not to mention the unbalanced schedule helps a lot) In fact, I'm not even sure if there are interconference games in the ECHL this year before the Kelly Cup, so no trips to California.

As for rivalries-the rivalries are already there for these teams in the ECHL and have been for years-you can't artificially create them.

Also Norfolk's staying in the AHL next year, the Admirals will find another parent.

[sportsguy12]

Its not a question of history,but more of economics and rivalaries, both Pensacola and Augusta and to a certain extent Columbia are in the bottom third of attendance of the ECHL. Long road trips to Toledo and California must take a huge drain on operating expenses for these teams, it just makes better sense to play in SPHL.Is it better to lose money and see teams fold or is better that these teams can survive in a league with the attendence figures these teams generate. Do not feel sorry for the ECHL, Greensboro,Mrtyle Beach,Mississippi and possibly Norfolk joining them next year.

First off, Norfolk might lose the B-Hawks, but they will never leave the AHL. They've already made that quite clear.

There are a lot of minor league teams that lose money each year. Looking at the ECHL vs. SPHL attendance. Pensacola and Augusta are more than holding their own. Plus, if they dropped a league, their attendance would follow. Part of the draw of the ECHL is seeing future stars in the NHL and AHL aka prospects.

I don't believe either will fold or have ever talked about it. So there's nothing more here to talk about. Game (thread) over!

[nksports]

Macon has tried and failed time and time again, so I think they need a break. Both the ECHL and SPHL have tried and failed. Give it a rest there!

don't forget the CHL, where Macon hockey started

[icepilotfan]

in response to what some have been saying about pensacola, i think that most fans would accept the sphl , as opposed to not having any hockey @all and as far as a rival goes i think as close as we are to some of the other teams, we would have a rival rather quickley. as i stated to another member we (the icepilots) are on the deathpool on pro hockey.com so yes i think the sphl would work here ,some of the fans i have talked to have stated that they would like the league here if something should happen. and by the way i read somewhere on here that greensboro would be getting a team, well that is one of the cities that is mentioned on the our death pool as possible relocations for the icepilots. so as for myself i hope the sphl does come , i really think the fans would get a kick out of it. merrychristmas everyone! icepilotfan.

[uvaviper]

I was told Roanoke was coming in.

[canuck steve]

I was told Roanoke was coming in.

So the rumours have started, will the SPHL expand by 2 teams or 4,will Pee Dee relocate, the league has a chance to soldify its base,,Roanoke,Pensacola,Macon,Greenville,and Columbia seem the best fits. There is some hockey base and knowledge on each city which helps right from the start. Why would a ECHL drop down, the business plan of a SPHL makes more sense. The arenas of those cities would love to have another 30 to 40 dates to make some revenue. Is a win win for all parties, providing the league can get owner's who will promote the team,the game and the league.

[sportsguy12]

in response to what some have been saying about pensacola, i think that most fans would accept the sphl , as opposed to not having any hockey @all and as far as a rival goes i think as close as we are to some of the other teams, we would have a rival rather quickley. as i stated to another member we (the icepilots) are on the deathpool on pro hockey.com so yes i think the sphl would work here ,some of the fans i have talked to have stated that they would like the league here if something should happen. and by the way i read somewhere on here that greensboro would be getting a team, well that is one of the cities that is mentioned on the our death pool as possible relocations for the icepilots. so as for myself i hope the sphl does come , i really think the fans would get a kick out of it. merrychristmas everyone! icepilotfan.

that fans would support the sphl more than the echl? So what if the icepilots are on the deathpool of prohockey.com. Does that mean that they are right? I think the Ice Pilots decline is their own fault. For starters, their new logo is awful. Its about as un-fan friendly as you can get. Independent hockey is not the way to go.

[sportsguy12]

The Southern League seems to be on an upswing,heres my take for next for next year.Pee Dee has to be moved either Greenville or Macon would be ideal,with the other city getting an expansion franchise, and i t would make sense for Pensacola and Augusta to leave the ECHL and join up with the SHL.

Upswing? It's still a new league and there's talk of Florida folding up shop, Macon already did as did Winston-Salem.

Pee Dee might move? I'm a little confused by the upswing thing ... did I miss something? Please fill me in.

[sportsguy12]

Its not a question of history,but more of economics and rivalaries, both Pensacola and Augusta and to a certain extent Columbia are in the bottom third of attendance of the ECHL. Long road trips to Toledo and California must take a huge drain on operating expenses for these teams, it just makes better sense to play in SPHL.Is it better to lose money and see teams fold or is better that these teams can survive in a league with the attendence figures these teams generate. Do not feel sorry for the ECHL, Greensboro,Mrtyle Beach,Mississippi and possibly Norfolk joining them next year.

Teams don't make long road trips every year and generally (PLEASE READ THIS CAREFULLY) they only make the trips (AND THIS IS THE IMPORTANT PART) if they want to = meaning they can afford it.

Just because teams are in the bottom of attendance 1) doesn't mean that they are looking to move and 2) why would they move and think that attendance would increase going to a new league.

If there's a new arena involved then maybe, but that's not the case. I haven't heard anything about Columbia leaving the ECHL, so I think your remarks are way off base.

[canuck steve]

Does anyone else have a thought on what the SPHL will look like for next, status quo, more teams or less teams and if there are more teams, where do you think they will locate, would be interested to hear from people in Macon,Greenville,Ashville,Brimingham.Pensacola,Mob ile,Augusta, Columbia and etc.

[uvaviper]

Some guy Pierer Pairmont is suppose to be buying a Team for Roanoke.
The same guy who used to own the Express in early ninetys.
Norfolk is in the AHL and I've heard they are not going to the ECHL.

[sportsguy12]

Some guy Pierer Pairmont is suppose to be buying a Team for Roanoke.
The same guy who used to own the Express in early ninetys.
Norfolk is in the AHL and I've heard they are not going to the ECHL.

Where do you people get this stuff? No, Norfolk just sank $70+ million into renovating the Scope. Why would they then drop from the AHL to the ECHL. The Blackhawks may leave for Rockford. But even then, Florida or Edmonton would move in.

[uvaviper]

Read close. I said the WERE NOT leaving the AHL. As someone had posted before. Tighten up your skills before jumping on my back. LOL

[HockeyFan70]

Does anyone else have a thought on what the SPHL will look like for next, status quo, more teams or less teams and if there are more teams, where do you think they will locate, would be interested to hear from people in Macon,Greenville,Ashville,Brimingham.Pensacola,Mob ile,Augusta, Columbia and etc.

IMO, the SPHL is making probably the best "Effort" at stability and growth. The league itself doesn't seem to be forcing expansion like the UHL. That league has to have at least two expansion teams to offset their losses yearly. The SPHL will have problems just like every league does. Sometimes it is a matter of mom and dad not having the money to go to every game, no matter what the league.

[uvaviper]

especially on school nights. No matter what the league people will not come every night. Unless you have the big city population. The SPHL is what the ECHL used to be about 15 years ago. But I think they are headed in the right direction. Roanoke hockey is back.

[rams80]

So the rumours have started, will the SPHL expand by 2 teams or 4,will Pee Dee relocate, the league has a chance to soldify its base,,Roanoke,Pensacola,Macon,Greenville,and Columbia seem the best fits. There is some hockey base and knowledge on each city which helps right from the start. Why would a ECHL drop down, the business plan of a SPHL makes more sense. The arenas of those cities would love to have another 30 to 40 dates to make some revenue. Is a win win for all parties, providing the league can get owner's who will promote the team,the game and the league.

So what makes you think this is true for some of these markets (besides out and out hatred for the ECHL?)

Also viper-I thought the arena in Roanoke wouldn't talk to anyone about hockey after the Valley Vipers fiasco.

[uvaviper]

I didn't think so either Ram. But they are. They have college hockey there this winter and that has been going outstanding. Maybe thats why. It's the home rink for Virginia Tech.

[rams80]

I didn't think so either Ram. But they are. They have college hockey there this winter and that has been going outstanding. Maybe thats why. It's the home rink for Virginia Tech.

I would point out that its highly unlikely that Virginia Tech would ever miss payments on anything...

Or go belly up after a year or two...

[uvaviper]

They might not lose money but they might stomp on opposing players legs or mess with thier girlfriends little sisters. lol lol lol lol (Marcus Vick)

[Geoff]

It is quite possible for VT to nopt pay for the venue. In fact, VTU doesn't pay for it. If anyone does, the team does. Club teams, of any sport, don't get much money at all from their schools.

[ECHLfan]

Hockey was taking of in the south a few years back, but like in all things the honeymoon is soon over. Look at Louisiana in the ECHL, they used to draw over 11,000 avg. attendance, where are they now? We had New Orleans, Baton Rouge, Birmingham, Mobile, Macon, Columbus (SPHL), Pee Dee (SPHL), Winston-Salem, Roanoke, Richmond (SPHL), Nashville (NHL), Louisville, Little Rock, Greensboro, Jacksonville (SPHL), Miami and I've probably missed one or two.

There needs to be committed ownership for a team to do well. You just can't say, "I think 'll own a hockey team and away you go."

The team from Florida had someone with no hockey sense as the owner. A beautiful new arena and many people said they never even heard there was a hockey team in town. If I had the cash, I would put a team in the Silver Spurs Arena and join the ECHL. With the right plan, you could easily avg. 5,000.

The SPHL should shore up the teams they have before they start to look at adding more. Then mid way through the season they won't have to scramble to readjust the schedule because 1 or 2 teams have folded.

[ECHLfan]

Was checking out the SPHL website and was trying to find the seating capacity for each teams home arena. Can anyone help out? I figure the arena in Jacksonville would be the biggest.

Thanks!

[nksports]

It is quite possible for VT to nopt pay for the venue. In fact, VTU doesn't pay for it. If anyone does, the team does. Club teams, of any sport, don't get much money at all from their schools.

Dues for a college club team can run as high as a couple thousand dollars a year. Some teams make enough from ticket sales or other fund raisers to make it cheaper for the players. Some club teams have travel schedules that rival NCAA D-I teams without the support from the school.

[Geoff]

Columbus: 7,600 for hockey
Fayetteville: 9,715 for hockey
Huntsville: 6,602 for hockey
Jacksonville: 14,000 (for hockey?)
Knoxville: 6,800 for hockey
PeeDee: 7,426 for hockey
Richmond: 11,088 for hockey

[canuck steve]

How will the league look next year,I believe Pee Dee should relocate, they fans just won't come out, Macon,Tallahassee, and back to Ocelea should help.Still think its prudent for teams like Pensacola,Columbia and Augusta to leave the ECHL and play in this league withs its lower overhead.

[ECHLfan]

Thanks for the attendence figures.

Recent article has Pee Dee trying to get a better arena deal. Will have to wait to see what happens.
Same with Pensacola in the ECHL, the people there don't seem to care.

There should be a few changes during the summer, will be interesting to see.

[Minor League Man]

Thanks for the attendence figures.

Recent article has Pee Dee trying to get a better arena deal. Will have to wait to see what happens.
Same with Pensacola in the ECHL, the people there don't seem to care.

There should be a few changes during the summer, will be interesting to see.
I, for one, am all for a new arena deal in Pensacola!

The IcePilots have exclusivity sports rights to the arena-which I say is a monopoly.

[rams80]

I, for one, am all for a new arena deal in Pensacola!

The IcePilots have exclusivity sports rights to the arena-which I say is a monopoly.

It's a legal one though...(Kind of like how Global gets exclusive sports rights to the CHL for its arena's inaugural year).

[canuck steve]

I, for one, am all for a new arena deal in Pensacola!

The IcePilots have exclusivity sports rights to the arena-which I say is a monopoly.

The Ice Pilots have folded in the ECHL.might be a good place to relocate Pee Dee.

[Guardfan3]

not gonna happen. they are waiting for an agreement to be finalized in Winston-Salem. Not necessarily a good move, given recent history in WS, but seems to be the most likely right now. I feel bad for fans in Florence, but I always enjoyed going to WS. Hopefully ownership can keep things going there for longer than the last few teams.

Wouldn't mind adding another team in Pensacola, but might be a good idea to wait a year to let things settle down there. Also makes fans appreciate a team more when the do without for a year. they are more willing to accept a lower league (that may have been part of the problem with Florence.)

[nksports]

It's a legal one though...(Kind of like how Global gets exclusive sports rights to the CHL for its arena's inaugural year).

Cause Global owns the CHL

[TheHulk]

Just to let you guys know....Pensacola is not folding...they are relocating. Either way it is a shock to the system for every hockey fan down here in NW Florida. The county and the team couldn't agree on new terms of the arena lease. The new owner is an a-hole anyway, but the fact that something that has been a mainstay in this area for so long is a really sad story. We will miss the Ice Pilots dearly.

I just hope hockey returns in one form or another. SPHL, CHL, whatever league it is...it will be welcomed with open arms. Seriously, besides the beach and bars what else is a person to do in this area.

[kekemortson]

I know it is a long ways off, if ever, but I would love to see hockey come back to Macon, GA. I miss hockey.....:(

[chdahs]

The Ice Pilots have folded in the ECHL.might be a good place to relocate Pee Dee.

not if they just signed two players today.

http://www.icepilots.com

[sportsguy12]

not if they just signed two players today.

http://www.icepilots.com

They just signed a new deal to compete in the ECHL.

[Geoff]

No. They didn't sign a new deal to compete in the ECHL. The League basically forced Mario to try to work out a new lease deal. The County allowed them to revert back to the old lease (which they had already been apporved to get out of) and they are now supposedly working on an extension of at least 5 years.

[sportsguy12]

No. They didn't sign a new deal to compete in the ECHL. The League basically forced Mario to try to work out a new lease deal. The County allowed them to revert back to the old lease (which they had already been apporved to get out of) and they are now supposedly working on an extension of at least 5 years.

let me re-phrase what I said. The Pensacola Ice Pilots will play in the ECHL. Is that vague enough now so we can sidestep the annoying semantics.

[Minor League Man]

The monopoly continues...

[Geoff]

Unfortunately. I hope, that if they do sign a new lease/extension, that calse is thrown out.

[TheHulk]

Unfortunately. I hope, that if they do sign a new lease/extension, that calse is thrown out.

For the SPHL a team in Tallahassee makes more sense than Pensacola. The IP will stay at least one more season after this. Besides with the team actually wanting to purchase the arena might have some impact on wether the team stays or goes. If they buy they will stay for good. At any rate, the SPHL would be wise to put a team in Tallahassee. Great market that deserve minor league sports. Outside of Jacksonville; Tallahassee is the largest city in Northern Florida it's a shame they don't have minor league sports.

[Geoff]

Tallahassee SPHL would have been the 4th rate tenant but now they are back to 3rd rate. They'd be waiting for FSU Basketball (Men's and Women's) before they got anyweekend dates. If they could sign a lease stipulation a decent number of weekend dates (should be easier than in the ECHL days considering the lower number of games) I know of a lot of people that would be happy: FSU's hockey team (actual home ice and a place to practice), my girlfriend and I, friends I have from other boards that were Tigersharks fans, and a group of locals (myself included) who are trying to find a way to get ice back in Tally (they're currently looking at converting a roller rink into an ice rink.

[PeterPuck]

I realize this is my first post, but this would be my reason for registering...

I have heard from inside the building, that LAKELAND, is saving dates for SPHL hockey.

I find this a little puzzling considering the manner in which the Loggerheads and the WHA2 p*ssed on the town representing the third minor hockey team to fail miserably in this market.

Where I do agree that the previous attempts were grossly underfunded, I do belive that the product can work here. Whomever comes in to Lakeland as an owner must be prepared to lose money for at least the first two seasons. It will take a massive advertising and public relations campaign to win over an area that has already been left with a bad taste in it's mouth three times over.

Is there an owner at this level out there willing to make that commitment?

[Pink Willie]

I know a couple of things about the Loggerheads. They had, hands down, no contest the hottest puck bunny’s in the league and it was a great place to road trip to!!!

[PeterPuck]

:eek:

Hopefully you never saw the Fan Club! Hearts of gold, but most looked like Esa Tikkanen with a thyroid condition.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y27/seanryann/tikv.jpg

Lakeland has the POTENTIAL to be a good market for the SPHL. Lots of snowbirds (mostly Michigan, and Ontario folks) and retirees. But getting the local businesses to buy in will be the problem. The Lakeland Thunderbolts (NIFL, AIFL) left town after three seasons and a championship. Even as a winning franchise in a big football town they weren't able to attract very many fans or any major sponsors.

Without a MAJOR investmet in advertising, proper marketing, and tons of in-your-face public relations, another hockey team in Lakeland will fail as well.

Don't let me let the building (the Lakeland Center and in essence the city as well since its a city run facility) off the hook here either. They need to be more cooperative and help cross promote the team in conjunction with other events in thier facility. That will help sell tickets, help advertise, and help show that the city is committed to having the team as a partner rather than just a temporary tennant.

I'd love to see a new franchise here flourish for a long long time. I just hope that if they do it, they do it right.

[Mark]

Tallahassee has a civic center that would serve nicely as a hockey rink, and used to be the home of the Tiger Sharks. It has a large snow-bird population, and should make a decent draw.

Albany (Ga) has a smaller facility, but it has the ability to convert to an ice rink. However, they don't have the population necessary to support the team, and we don't want another Macon.

As to Mobile (my personal choice), I don't know what facilities they have, but I don't think there's any teams in that area.

[Geoff]

Mobile wants $10,000 per game for rent as per the last attempt to put a team there (SEHL/WHA2 battle before the EHL/SHL/SPHL). Tallahassee has snowbirds? Hardly, the only reason you see tags from up north is student from up north. Tally isnt a beach town and doesnt have much to offer snowbirds. A team in tally would draw fans from Quincy, Bainbridge, Thomasville, and snowbirds and fans from Panama City and Panama City Beach.

If you heavily market the team to college kids (FAMU, TCC, along with FSU) and make affordable (especially for fans coming some distance) and it could be successful. Hell if we got a team and I get a decnet job (not easy with 2 universities, a community college, and about 9 high schools) I'd be one of the first in like to be a STH.

Albany has been very successful in the af2 averaging close to 7,000 a year. If they can market to that same fan base and work in tandem with the Wildcats, they could draw really well.

[Mark]

Now that minor-league baseball in The Good Life City is officially dead, you may be right. Also, given the fact that it sits empty most of the year, I would think the league could get the Civic Center at fire-sale prices right now. They haven't offered a concert there in years. I know if I were the City of Albany's manager, I would be actively courting the league with every incentive I could imagine. Columbus seems to have made a success of hockey, so it's possible Albany could rise to the challenge.

As to the success AF2 is having in the Albany market, southwest Georgia is football country. People here eat, drink and sleep the stuff. It's second only to sex on most people's agenda. The Peanuts and the SCL weren't able to tie into that success, but they also found themselves competing for attendance on some play dates.

(BTW, if any SPHL officials are watching, you'll have a ready-made season-ticket holder in me if you come to town.)