Nice manuver buy afl name at rummage sale and get the lipstick out!!

[douglas mccarthy]

Put lipsick on this slapped together aft2 pig hide from your creditors and pay the nfl network to play on thier station with none of your money but with the blind aft2 owners money that drank your koolaid cause they found a cheap way to try and dupe the public into thinking they are bigger then just some aft 2 refugees they really are!! With jerry saying everything is all good!!!!jerry please take a snap out of it pill!!!!!! Get the lipstick ready!!

[Jamie]

You sound like a spurned lover.

[indoor fan]

Haters hatin!

The AFL is back and ready to roll in 2010.

He should be more concerned with one of his IFL teams almost losing to a semi pro team.

IFL=AIFA

[Bruiser]

IFL=AIFA
Man, you forgot the rest of the equation....

in 2010,
IFL=AIFA=AFL=CIFL=SIFL

It's really all the same now dude, just glorified semi-pro leagues.
You simply cannot call these guys real pro ballers while making poverty wages.

[indoor fan]

Man, you forgot the rest of the equation....

in 2010,
IFL=AIFA=AFL=CIFL=SIFL

It's really all the same now dude, just glorified semi-pro leagues.
You simply cannot call these guys real pro ballers while making poverty wages.

I guess after a semi pro outdoor team almost beats an IFL team, I guess I do need to correct the equation:

IFL=AIFA=CIFL=SIFL

Thanks!

Semi pro teams don't play on NFL Network. Are these players on the Dallas roster semi pro:

Larry Brackins
Eddie Moten
Phil Bogel
Speedy Gonzalez
Will Pettis
Derek Lee
Josh White
Duke Pettijohn
Shane Stafford


I love it. A few IFL fans have their panties in a twist. The AFL has dropped a couple of bombs on a very few of you. Just worry about yourselves and your own league.

AFL is back baby.....like it or not.

[newiflfan]

I love it. A few IFL fans have their panties in a twist.

One could argue that with the way you are so quick to praise the AFL and throw the IFL under the bus, that you too have your bloomers in a wad.



...Back to the sidelines I go in this argument.

[daytonadan]

Put lipsick on this slapped together aft2 pig hide from your creditors and pay the nfl network to play on thier station with none of your money but with the blind aft2 owners money that drank your koolaid cause they found a cheap way to try and dupe the public into thinking they are bigger then just some aft 2 refugees they really are!! With jerry saying everything is all good!!!!jerry please take a snap out of it pill!!!!!! Get the lipstick ready!!

You betta get some lipstick ready,boy, becuase you're gonna be kissing the Slaughter's BEE-HIND after they kick your BEE-HIND this year.

WOO-- EE, I loves me some trash talkin'.

[tony-o]

Semi pro teams don't play on NFL Network. Are these players on the Dallas roster semi pro:

Larry Brackins
Eddie Moten
Phil Bogel
Speedy Gonzalez
Will Pettis
Derek Lee
Josh White
Duke Pettijohn
Shane Stafford

1. I've seen Division II college teams play on the NFL Network. This is nowhere near close to the NBC deal they had, which wasn't that great of a deal to start with.
2. If those players aren't semi-pro, then I'm pretty sure Dallas is breaking some of the league's rules about salaries.
3. I haven't heard of half of those guys, and one of those players was a cartoon character last time I checked.

[indoor fan]

1. I've seen Division II college teams play on the NFL Network. This is nowhere near close to the NBC deal they had, which wasn't that great of a deal to start with.
2. If those players aren't semi-pro, then I'm pretty sure Dallas is breaking some of the league's rules about salaries.
3. I haven't heard of half of those guys, and one of those players was a cartoon character last time I checked.

NFL Network has never shown D2 football. They have shown college bowl games and a few D1 games. The NFLN deal is a no lose for the AFL. They just play the games and split the revenue. A great deal. The average fans will associate the AFL with the NFL (check the AFL website)

You must not follow Arena football, if you have not heard of those guys.

[Tuxedo]

Put lipsick on this slapped together aft2 pig hide from your creditors and pay the nfl network to play on thier station with none of your money but with the blind aft2 owners money that drank your koolaid cause they found a cheap way to try and dupe the public into thinking they are bigger then just some aft 2 refugees they really are!! With jerry saying everything is all good!!!!jerry please take a snap out of it pill!!!!!! Get the lipstick ready!!

What is this aft 2 you speak of??? I've never heard of the aft2... Hey Doug don't let reality get in the way of your thoughts. :D

[Bruiser]

What is this aft 2 you speak of??? I've never heard of the aft2... Hey Doug don't let reality get in the way of your thoughts. :D
A quick witted person could easily determine what league he's referencing. It's not that hard to do. Now I suffer the same affliction as poor Doug does in Fatfingeritis. They need to make poor souls like us wider key pads.

[Bruiser]

I guess after a semi pro outdoor team almost beats an IFL team, I guess I do need to correct the equation:

IFL=AIFA=CIFL=SIFL

Thanks!

Semi pro teams don't play on NFL Network. Are these players on the Dallas roster semi pro:

Larry Brackins
Eddie Moten
Phil Bogel
Speedy Gonzalez
Will Pettis
Derek Lee
Josh White
Duke Pettijohn
Shane Stafford


I love it. A few IFL fans have their panties in a twist. The AFL has dropped a couple of bombs on a very few of you. Just worry about yourselves and your own league.

AFL is back baby.....like it or not.
I dont know why I must continue to correct you. I've said on numerous occassions I am going to enjoy both the IFL and AFL seasons this year... probably take in quite a few games of the CIFL club here in Chicago too.

It is simply astonishing to me that some of the AFL-only fans refuse to take the blinders off and think for themselves instead of what they are told to.

[Tannerman]

The NFLN deal is a no lose for the AFL. They just play the games and split the revenue. A great deal.

Which is the same deal AFL 1.0 had with NBC... and it wasn't exactly a no-lose for the league, when you look at the amount of cash they owed creditors relating to broadcast expenses.

[indoor fan]

Which is the same deal AFL 1.0 had with NBC... and it wasn't exactly a no-lose for the league, when you look at the amount of cash they owed creditors relating to broadcast expenses.

NFLN will pay for broadcast expenses.

[indoor fan]

I dont know why I must continue to correct you. I've said on numerous occassions I am going to enjoy both the IFL and AFL seasons this year... probably take in quite a few games of the CIFL club here in Chicago too.

It is simply astonishing to me that some of the AFL-only fans refuse to take the blinders off and think for themselves instead of what they are told to.

So why does this anger you so much? You should be happy the Rush are back in Chi town.

[Bruiser]

So why does this anger you so much? You should be happy the Rush are back in Chi town.
No anger. Just tired of repeating things only to have it go in some of you people's ear and out the other. Coupled with watching folks fall for the same old BS from league HQ it is more frustrating than anything else.

[indoor fan]

No anger. Just tired of repeating things only to have it go in some of you people's ear and out the other. Coupled with watching folks fall for the same old BS from league HQ it is more frustrating than anything else.

So what's the problem with fans watching and enjoying the AFL. You should just be happy it's back, no matter in what form. Just more football to watch and follow. How is that a bad thing? Seems only you and Caballo feel that way.

[Caballo Diablo]

So what's the problem with fans watching and enjoying the AFL. You should just be happy it's back, no matter in what form. Just more football to watch and follow. How is that a bad thing? Seems only you and Caballo feel that way.

This is why many can't take your posts or opinion serious.

Where did I say it's a problem if fans watch and/or enjoy it? I've stated many times on several forums I'm glad they'll be playing ArenaBall this season. But it never went anywhere, I watched lot's of ArenaBall last season.

Your Homerism is deteriorating your comprehension.

[IndoorExpert]

This conversation has gone on way too long. Does it really matter which league each individual diverse person thinks is better? Both leagues are different and both are not without problems. A television deal means nothing if it isnt being watched or making money. I wish all leagues the best of luck in 2010 and that includes the IFL, AIFA, CIFL, SIFL, AFL, and any other lower level league trying to make a quality production. If the fans are excited and it gives players the opportunity to keep playing in a tough business, why is there ANY argument. Isnt this comparing apples to oranges anyways. These games are too different to compare.

This conversation is now getting negative against the players as who is the better players. The funny part is these guys for the most part came out of the same Division I, Division IAA, Division II, or Division III programs. They are the same players from the NCAA. How can you claim the players are so much better based on league affiliation? Why did Pierre Garcon have such a great season with the Colts? Why do NFL players go to the indoor leagues and look terrible? Being at the right place at the right time has as much to do with this debate as anything else.

Good luck to all the participants and coaches as the leagues begin to kick-off this weekend. I will be at an IFL game this weekend having a blast.......

[indoor fan]

This conversation has gone on way too long. Does it really matter which league each individual diverse person thinks is better? Both leagues are different and both are not without problems. A television deal means nothing if it isnt being watched or making money. I wish all leagues the best of luck in 2010 and that includes the IFL, AIFA, CIFL, SIFL, AFL, and any other lower level league trying to make a quality production. If the fans are excited and it gives players the opportunity to keep playing in a tough business, why is there ANY argument. Isnt this comparing apples to oranges anyways. These games are too different to compare.

This conversation is now getting negative against the players as who is the better players. The funny part is these guys for the most part came out of the same Division I, Division IAA, Division II, or Division III programs. They are the same players from the NCAA. How can you claim the players are so much better based on league affiliation? Why did Pierre Garcon have such a great season with the Colts? Why do NFL players go to the indoor leagues and look terrible? Being at the right place at the right time has as much to do with this debate as anything else.

Good luck to all the participants and coaches as the leagues begin to kick-off this weekend. I will be at an IFL game this weekend having a blast.......

Very true. There really is not a debate. The AFL is the highest level of the 50 yard game.

Like I've said before, I follow the indoor game, but even I "INDOOR FAN", realize that the AFL has more talent than the Intense, UIF, AIFA, SIFL, CIFL leagues.

That's it. Done.

[Bruiser]

Like I've said before, I follow the indoor game, but even I "INDOOR FAN", realize that the AFL has more talent than the Intense, UIF, AIFA, SIFL, CIFL leagues.

That's it. Done.
Not quite done. Freud smiles down upon us.
You slip sir and left the IFL off your list.
Bwhahahahahahaha.

[indoor fan]

Not quite done. Freud smiles down upon us.
You slip sir and left the IFL off your list.
Bwhahahahahahaha.

The IFL is the Intense and UIF leagues Bwhahahahaha

[IndoorExpert]

There is only one league that can boast the best talent. That league is called the NFL.

All of the other leagues pick from the leftovers, players who were overlooked, or guys that blossomed later. Look at every AFL team roster, and look at all of the indoor league rosters. I see the same type of trends (Division I, IAA, II, and III players). What is your rational about the college trends? I think you get confused as to what you are talking about. How are you comparing the athletes? Maybe you are just a die hard AFL fan that cannot admit the reality of the situation.

2010 Arizona Rattlers Team Roster

# Position Name Height Weight Experience Date of Birth College
0 OL Booker, John 6' 4" 325 lbs Rookie 04/23/1986 San Jose State
0 LB Chude, Valentine 6' 2" 250 lbs Rookie 08/24/1983 Western New Mexico
0 QB Davila, Nick 6' 3" 210 lbs Rookie 05/22/1985 Cincinnati
0 WR Devoe, Tod 6' 2" 198 lbs Rookie 04/05/1980 Central Missouri State
0 DL Doolittle, Tez 6' 3" 285 lbs Rookie 12/18/1984 Auburn
0 QB Farris, Billy 6' 3" 225 lbs Rookie 03/02/1985 Colorado State
0 DB Freeman, Brandon 6' 2" 205 lbs Rookie 03/05/1985 Massachusetts
0 DB Gilliam, Sergio 6' 3" 195 lbs Rookie 01/29/1985 Clemson
0 DL Guerrero, Alex 6' 1" 275 lbs Rookie 02/16/1984 Boise State
0 WR Harvey, Trandon 5' 10" 197 lbs Rookie 05/23/1983 Washington State
0 DL Hawthorne, Anttaj 6' 3" 310 lbs Rookie 11/15/1981 Wisconsin
0 OL Herrion, Atlas 6' 4" 305 lbs Rookie 12/03/1980 Alabama
0 WR Ingram, Kevin 6' 0" 193 lbs Rookie 06/19/1977 West Chester
0 WR Jones, Jason 6' 1" 195 lbs Rookie 08/30/1983 Arkansas Pine-Bluff
0 DL Jones, Ron 6' 4" 275 lbs Rookie 09/17/1981 Southern Mississippi
0 LB Kahui, Kurt 6' 1" 250 lbs Rookie 10/18/1984 San Diego State
0 FB Kirton, Johnie 6' 3" 285 lbs Rookie 03/17/1986 Washington
0 WR McKelvey, JJ 6' 4" 225 lbs Rookie 03/15/1980 Clemson
0 WR Mix, Anthony 6' 5" 230 lbs Rookie 01/20/1983 Auburn
0 LB Morris, Kelvin 6' 4" 245 lbs Rookie 10/25/1982 Clemson
0 OL Obeng, William 6' 7" 340 lbs Rookie 04/14/1983 San Jose State
0 DL Pittman, Marcus 6' 5" 290 lbs Rookie 05/10/1986 Troy
0 OL Reddick, Troy 6' 6" 325 lbs Rookie 12/12/1983 Auburn
0 DB Roland, Travis 5' 10" 190 lbs Rookie 08/26/1986 Bethune-Cookman
0 DB Sanders, Terrance 5' 10" 180 lbs Rookie 11/23/1983 Eastern Illinois
0 DL Shropshire, Darrell 6' 2" 301 lbs Rookie 03/18/1983 South Carolina
0 DB Swanson, Riley 6' 0" 185 lbs Rookie 04/20/1984 Wake Forest
0 DL Thomas, Walter 6' 5" 330 lbs Rookie 05/20/1985 Oklahoma State
0 FB Trentadue, Frank 6' 0" 260 lbs Rookie 11/08/1975 Elmhurst
0 WR Windsor, Rod 6' 2" 210 lbs Rookie 04/24/1985 Western New Mexico
0 OL Young, Kyle 6' 4" 315 lbs Rookie 03/05/1984 Fresno State

Now look up all of the IFL rosters, is there that much of a disparity? My answer is NO!!!! I see the same type of trends (Division I, IAA, II, and III players). I rest my case!!!!

[daytonadan]

Another. Silly. Argument.

The greatest running back of all-time (Walter Payton) played at Jackson State.

The greatest wide receiver (Jerry Rice) came from Mississippi Valley State.

One of the greatest offensive linemen and anchor of the 72 Dolphins was my boy Larry Little from the great Bethune-Cookman University, which now has five players in the outdoor Sunday fall league.

One of the great coaches, Don Shula, didn't even start for John Carroll, a Division III school on the banks of Lake Erie in Cleveland.

Phil Simms has a Super Bowl ring and he matriculated from Morehead State University, based in Morehead, Kentucky. Everyone says ... (double entendre willingly censured) is good.

It's all about making the most of the opportunity at the right time.

Case in point, I'm meeting with the sports editor of the Dallas Morning News in planning what kind of coverage the Frisco Thunder would get in 2008. He used that argument about the quality of players we had. My response was "Well, that outdoor team in Irving you cover played his college ball at Eastern Illinois and is banging Jessica Simpson. Worked for him."

I got the coverage I wanted and a freelance contract out of that...

[Bruiser]

The IFL is the Intense and UIF leagues Bwhahahahaha
No it isn't. The last time those leagues were around the real AFL WAS the more talented league. Bwhahahahahahaha.

[Bruiser]

There is only one league that can boast the best talent. That league is called the NFL.

All of the other leagues pick from the leftovers, players who were overlooked, or guys that blossomed later.
Very intelligent thought processes. Too bad not all are as astute.

[Bruiser]

Another. Silly. Argument.

Silly argument indeed. The greatest anything is so subjective when it comes to analyzing who's better ie: Payton or Jim Brown or Faulk? The debate about which criteria used to measure said greatness would be a big clusterf#@! all by itself. And it certainly doesnt follow that the most elite of the NFL players come from the top college programs - those schools may toss more bodies into the NFL pool every year but without even doing a search I can pretty much expect the Pro Football HoF is not full of dudes coming from the very best college programs. Why? I'm guessing it has to do with nurturing the concept of team at the collegiate level and not individual glory.

Of course there are going to be anomalys, the Kurt Warners and such, but overall I think it's apparent the majority of talent settles where it is supposed to be and that currently is the NFL #1 by a longshot, CFL and then the rest of these 50 yard leagues where the dregs shake out.

[indoor fan]

The real AFL is back. Just with a different salary structure than 2008.

The AFL provides players more money, bigger arenas and a National TV deal.

The indoor leagues offer players less money, smaller arenas and NO TV deals.

[Bouncer_Texxx]

Just remember that talent is subjective.

The AFL 2.0 has a shut down corner... really? where?
Talent at that position doesn't fit within the confines of the Arena defensive rules.

All of these arguments are being made about a league that hasn't played a single snap in a long time, with a bunch of familiar sounding names but none of the original parts. I can put a Mustang body kit on a Focus, it's still a Focus.

I rest my case.

[Caballo Diablo]

Another. Silly. Argument.

The greatest running back of all-time (Walter Payton) played at Jackson State.



Incorrect, the greatest RB of all time went to Syracuse.:D

[Caballo Diablo]

The real AFL is back. Just with a different salary structure than 2008. umm, no.

Is the salary structure really the only differences? Do you know the difference between an authenic jersey and a replica?

The AFL provides players more money, bigger arenas and a National TV deal.

The indoor leagues offer players less money, smaller arenas and NO TV deals.
Compensation varries team to team. When judging which company to work for do you look at salary only or the total compensation package?

I didn't realize you could call the NFLN National coverage, sure you can see it different parts of the Nation but it's an awful tiny footprint.

I thought both leagues had a global deal over the Internet.

Profitability should also fit into the equation, one was profitable last season and one didn't even play.

[douglas mccarthy]

The afl is paying the nfl networks just under a million bucks to broadcast their games the number is 75,000 paid to nfl networks a game ! The nfl network is not paying for the production!! So the fact is the afl imposter is paying to brand their lipstick covered pig to a broad cast company that just has a name "the nf"l and a very limited viewership in the off season . Not in half as many home as the ifl,s deal!! But thats jerry curses m.o. Buy the name and they will just think your bigtime even with a bunch of aft2 player,s mixed in with a bunch of overated arena players and charge astronomical fees[that he [pockets by the way] that will be its downfall again !thats if the chasing creditors dont find a way before that to slap an injuction on his latest move to dodge them!!!!!good lord!!snap out of it!! Next the ifl will be playing on america 1 nework that will be announce in the next couple days! Which has exclusive rights on the cfl already and brosdcatst to 40 to 55 million homes across the us its affiliates are comcast and fox sports!now what mr indoor fan!!!!!!lol

[Bruiser]

Just remember that talent is subjective.

The AFL 2.0 has a shut down corner... really? where?
Talent at that position doesn't fit within the confines of the Arena defensive rules.

All of these arguments are being made about a league that hasn't played a single snap in a long time, with a bunch of familiar sounding names but none of the original parts.


Not to be a smart ass, but I will. The IFL by comparison has a shut down corner.. really? where? If there were true shut down corners in the 50 yard game the combined final scores wouldnt always be in the high 50's, 60's or 70's all the time.

Agree with that second paragraph though.

[douglas mccarthy]

you,ll see saturday night!:eek:

[Bouncer_Texxx]

Not to be a smart ass, but I will. The IFL by comparison has a shut down corner.. really? where? If there were true shut down corners in the 50 yard game the combined final scores wouldnt always be in the high 50's, 60's or 70's all the time.

Agree with that second paragraph though.

Sioux Falls has had several of the better corners in their leagues over the years. Kevin Adams came back form the AFL 1.0 last year and has stayed in SF this season. Just because one corner shuts his guy down, there are still 3 other receivers in the pattern. My argument is that defensive rules in the AFL prevent "top" (for this level) talent at defensive back.

[indoor fan]

The afl is paying the nfl networks just under a million bucks to broadcast their games the number is 75,000 paid to nfl networks a game ! The nfl network is not paying for the production!! So the fact is the afl imposter is paying to brand their lipstick covered pig to a broad cast company that just has a name "the nf"l and a very limited viewership in the off season . Not in half as many home as the ifl,s deal!! But thats jerry curses m.o. Buy the name and they will just think your bigtime even with a bunch of aft2 player,s mixed in with a bunch of overated arena players and charge astronomical fees[that he [pockets by the way] that will be its downfall again !thats if the chasing creditors dont find a way before that to slap an injuction on his latest move to dodge them!!!!!good lord!!snap out of it!! Next the ifl will be playing on america 1 nework that will be announce in the next couple days! Which has exclusive rights on the cfl already and brosdcatst to 40 to 55 million homes across the us its affiliates are comcast and fox sports!now what mr indoor fan!!!!!!lol

Huh...please provide the link.....AFL is not paying NFLN any upfront $$$$$...did you even read the PR...geez

[daytonadan]

Doug's just realizing that the Slaughter has become the premier CIFL refugee in the premier league and wants some attention,that's all.

Hi Dougie.Good owner. Go get the ball so the Chicago team can burn your DBs

Loves me some smack talk.

[Bouncer_Texxx]

Huh...please provide the link.....AFL is not paying NFLN any upfront $$$$$...did you even read the PR...geez

Can you prove they're not paying NFLN?

[daytonadan]

Jim Brown. Yep. One of the best.

All-time Cleveland on Madden was a force with him at RB, Otto Graham at QB and Paul Warfield at WR.

[Caballo Diablo]

Huh......did you even read the PR...geeznow we understand, you believe all the PR you read as gospel - lol

Psst, self promotion is a business trick that all advertising comes from. Exaggerate, twist, only release part of the story, they all do it.

Just ask dan.

[Caballo Diablo]

Jim Brown. Yep. One of the best.

All-time Cleveland on Madden was a force with him at RB, Otto Graham at QB and Paul Warfield at WR.
You know it, Otto led his team to 10 consecutive championship games.:mrgreen:

[NatePreds05]

now we understand, you believe all the PR you read as gospel - lol

Psst, self promotion is a business trick that all advertising comes from. Exaggerate, twist, only release part of the story, they all do it.

Just ask dan.

CD I don't consider the Sports Business Journal as "PR". Here is the article:

"NFL Network to broadcast new arena league’s games

Print This Story
By JOHN LOMBARDO & JOHN OURAND
Staff writers
Published February 08, 2010 : Page 03
The upstart AF1 has signed a television deal with the NFL Network, giving the nascent indoor football league an instant dose of credibility.

The deal is a one-year agreement, with another one-year option. Terms call for AF1 to sell the advertising inventory, with the indoor league and the NFL Network evenly splitting all revenue.

The NFL Network will provide the on-air talent. The league’s games will be aired live on Friday nights from 8 to 11 p.m. ET beginning April 2 through the league’s championship game in late August. The AF1 game on April 23 will be pre-empted by the network’s draft coverage.

Charles Coplin, vice president of programming for the NFL, said the deal made sense for the NFL Network, which has expanded beyond NFL programming by covering college football games.

“We embrace football at all levels,” Coplin said. “This spring schedule gives us a weekly live game featuring some players who may eventually play in the NFL.”

The NFL Network also was attracted by the AF1’s spring schedule, which comes at a relatively down time for the NFL, with no live games. “They are playing at a time where it made perfect sense for our schedule,” Coplin said.

The NFL Network has not made any decisions on the talent it will use or on any shoulder programming it may produce.

“Right now, the focus is just on the games,” Coplin said. “We’ll get back from South Florida and look at whether there’s anything to do around it.”

Coplin said the deal does not hint at a larger working relationship between the two football leagues.

“This is a programming deal between the NFL Network and [AF1] to cover their games,” he said. “The programming made sense to us. The economics made sense to us. It’s not indicative of a larger or broader relationship. This deal is very consistent with how we’ve programmed the network from the beginning.”

The deal is expected to be officially announced in mid-February. The 15-team league, which was created this year after the assets of the former AFL were sold out of bankruptcy, also is expected to be rebranded as the AFL before the start of the season.

AF1 Commissioner Jerry Kurz would not comment specifically on the television deal.

“We are pleased with where we are and we are about to announce a national game of the week arrangement,” Kurz said."

[Caballo Diablo]

CD I don't consider the Sports Business Journal as "PR". Huh? who's their source? Where did this partial info come from?


AF1 Commissioner Jerry Kurz would not comment specifically on the television deal.

“We are pleased with where we are and we are about to announce a national game of the week arrangement,” Kurz said."

Sorry, you're right. The Commish wouldn't be involved with positive only PR.

lol

[NatePreds05]

Huh? who's their source? Where did this partial info come from?

http://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/article/64774 is the link to the article. You would have to ask the writers if you wanted deeper info.

[Bruiser]

All this crazy Browns talk... one guy that always fascinated me and loved reading stories about was the big fullback, Marion Motley. Dudes yard per carry was wicked and I believe better than Brown or Payton. He must have carried tacklers down the field on his back. :)

[daytonadan]

Marion Motley.

One of the game's most unheralded RBs. Thank you for mentioning him, Bruiser.

[Caballo Diablo]

http://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/article/64774 is the link to the article. You would have to ask the writers if you wanted deeper info.

Wouldn't you think it came from the people he was quoting?

[Caballo Diablo]

Marion Motley.

One of the game's most unheralded RBs. Thank you for mentioning him, Bruiser.Another great in my memorabilia collection.

[Bruiser]

Another great in my memorabilia collection.

Really? I guess he had a lot more fans than I imagined. That's nice to know. Someone needs to do a biography about him. I remember when I used to collect those Swell HoF cards back in the 80's he was great for returning a short reply to a letter and an autograph thru the mail.

[NatePreds05]

Wouldn't you think it came from the people he was quoting?

You asked the question about who the source is, not me. Chris Coplin, vice president of programming for the NFL, sounds like a credible reliable non AFL source.

[Caballo Diablo]

Really? I guess he had a lot more fans than I imagined. That's nice to know. Someone needs to do a biography about him. I remember when I used to collect those Swell HoF cards back in the 80's he was great for returning a short reply to a letter and an autograph thru the mail.

One of my helmets was signed by Marion Motley, Jim Brown, Lou Groza, Dante Lavelli, Otto Graham, and Frank Gatski. All Browns Hall of Famers.

[Big Easy]

Why does it matter that the AFL is paying for coverage? How is that a negative? MANY teams not named the NFL PAY for their coverage. I know for a fact that many NBA teams pay for coverage (some work out sponsorship trade to off set the cost). The trade off is that they get to sell ad inventory during the broadcasts. I would wager to say that ALL minor league sports franchises/leagues pay for quality coverage. You try to trade out as much of that cost in "sponsorship" as you can, but in the end it costs you money....just like buying regular advertising on the station does.

[Bruiser]

Why does it matter that the AFL is paying for coverage? How is that a negative? MANY teams not named the NFL PAY for their coverage. I know for a fact that many NBA teams pay for coverage (some work out sponsorship trade to off set the cost). The trade off is that they get to sell ad inventory during the broadcasts. I would wager to say that ALL minor league sports franchises/leagues pay for quality coverage. You try to trade out as much of that cost in "sponsorship" as you can, but in the end it costs you money....just like buying regular advertising on the station does.
The more astute around here understand that, however the perception being touted by the AFL fanboys is that this is some kind of partnership between the NFL and AFL. Now we also know that fooling the public into buying something less than advertised is a common practice these days, so it's not that it is a negative but more an attempt at trying to get the light bulb turned on for those who are more impressionable to the Marketing 101 tactics.

[indoor fan]

The more astute around here understand that, however the perception being touted by the AFL fanboys is that this is some kind of partnership between the NFL and AFL. Now we also know that fooling the public into buying something less than advertised is a common practice these days, so it's not that it is a negative but more an attempt at trying to get the light bulb turned on for those who are more impressionable to the Marketing 101 tactics.

True. But right now AFL owners don't have deep enough pockets to "pay" for coverage. Clearly states that this is a one year deal between NFLN and AFL. Seems to be almost a bigger deal for NFLN as it gives them live football to broadcast in the spring.

[Bruiser]

True. But right now AFL owners don't have deep enough pockets to "pay" for coverage.
They found $6mil didnt they? I think the new AFL guys are dumping cash into this money pit big time and praying to god it takes off. I do believe every one of these owners has made a commitment to go ALL out and spend whatever it takes with the creedo "failure is not an option" ... because if it does flounder there are going to be quite a few of them in financial ruins. Then again what the heck do you and I know? We wouldnt have the balls to take these big risks in the first place.

[Big Easy]

True. But right now AFL owners don't have deep enough pockets to "pay" for coverage. Clearly states that this is a one year deal between NFLN and AFL. Seems to be almost a bigger deal for NFLN as it gives them live football to broadcast in the spring.

If the numbers are available I haven't looked at them...but assuming they can possibly break even or simply absorb a cost that fits their marketing budget, I think it's well worth the risk.

The AFL has damage control to do. They have to come back with a big splash of some sort to "prove" they are not your average indoor league posing as the AFL. You only get one chance at a first impression...and though they are using an established identity....it is a new impression of sorts.

If they came back in their first year and didn't have a presence greater than the other indoor leagues, they would be considered "small time" and not be living up to the equitable part of the AFL brand. Plus, you can bet they want to grow...they are already talking about adding teams and wealthy owners for next season. Re-launching without any type of noticable media package would be a detriment to their vision of the future.

Risky? Sure. But what propositon in arena/indoor football isn't. Fortune favors the bold. Or failure. I like the idea of shooting big now that they have a better business model in place. If they can minimize and/or absorb the short term losses, I think rebuilding the league through a national media package is a bold move that can and will pay off.

If they put this league together to simply be another arena/indoor football league who lives for today....who's goal is to play their entire schedule without cancellation....and survive season to season....then I'd say it's a bad move and they should watch their pennies.

[Bruiser]

If the numbers are available I haven't looked at them...but assuming they can possibly break even or simply absorb a cost that fits their marketing budget, I think it's well worth the risk.

The AFL has damage control to do. They have to come back with a big splash of some sort to "prove" they are not your average indoor league posing as the AFL. You only get one chance at a first impression...and though they are using an established identity....it is a new impression of sorts.

If they came back in their first year and didn't have a presence greater than the other indoor leagues, they would be considered "small time" and not be living up to the equitable part of the AFL brand. Plus, you can bet they want to grow...they are already talking about adding teams and wealthy owners for next season. Re-launching without any type of noticable media package would be a detriment to their vision of the future.

Risky? Sure. But what propositon in arena/indoor football isn't. Fortune favors the bold. Or failure. I like the idea of shooting big now that they have a better business model in place. If they can minimize and/or absorb the short term losses, I think rebuilding the league through a national media package is a bold move that can and will pay off.

If they put this league together to simply be another arena/indoor football league who lives for today....who's goal is to play their entire schedule without cancellation....and survive season to season....then I'd say it's a bad move and they should watch their pennies.

No doubt about it, that's why I am saying the current set of owners are going whole hog on this thing - with the exception of paying the players a decent compensation. But that's kinda the point. Therein lies the ultimate setup for failure. If the AFL are telling players they will eventually be in the red (edit: sorry I meant "black") and then can offer them more dough, that just starts the snowball rolling to disaster again. Eventually they will again see labor trouble like that which hurt them in 2000 when a CBA was ratified or conversley they capture an enthusiastic following among the masses and price their white trash minions out of the arena. Either way the people reading this message board right now are screwed.

Erego, I find myself rooting for the current status quo, where I can pay less than $10 to park my fatass for a few hours and watch a bunch of dudes knock heads.

[Panthers14]

Hell have no Fury like a Woman Scorned!!! You all sound like a bunch of P****** I for one know the difference, but I am glad the rebranded AF1 will be on the NFL Network. I have Directv and hope the IFL and the other indoor leagues have some games on this year as well. A true fan would relish the opportunity to see all of these leagues. My hope is for all of these leagues to flourish and grow to the point were someday we will have interleague play and a national indoor / arena playoff system in place to replace this trash talk.:mrgreen:

[Bruiser]

I have Directv
We're happy for you. :roll:


... hope the IFL and the other indoor leagues have some games on this year as well. A true fan would relish the opportunity to see all of these leagues.
Wrong, the true fan would get their butts to the arena and not care about some obscure little TV deal. The lazy ones sit at home on their backsides munching on ho-ho's and not supporting the teams where it matters most AT THE @#%! ARENA.

[newiflfan]

Wrong, the true fan would get their butts to the arena and not care about some obscure little TV deal. The lazy ones sit at home on their backsides munching on ho-ho's and not supporting the teams where it matters most AT THE @#%! ARENA.

I wouldn't say that you can only be a "true fan" if you go to games in person.

For example- I was in middle school when the GR Rampage started playing. I was extremely interested in the team, followed all the box scores through the paper, would watch their games the few (rare) times they were on TV, and never made it out to a game until I was in high school and had a car and a job to help pay for my own tickets. I would say that prior to making it out to that first game I was a true fan of the team. Some people who are true fans of a team want to go to games in person but can't, for one reason or another.

[Bruiser]

I would say that prior to making it out to that first game I was a true fan of the team.
Perhaps in your own mind, but not in the teams. If you aint spending the cash you're dead to them... and a dead fan ain't no true fan. Capiche?

[newiflfan]

Perhaps in your own mind, but not in the teams. If you aint spending the cash you're dead to them... and a dead fan ain't no true fan. Capiche?


I bought merch. With the little allowance money I was able to save up back in the middle school days I saved up and bought some merch. That seems like something a "true fan" would do, if I do say so myself.

Do you mean to say that a 12 year old who LOVES the Chargers, but lives in Michigan, isn't a true fan of San Diego? Please.

A fan that doesn't have the ability to spend cash can still spread the word. Word of mouth has the potential to bring extra fans to the gate. A fan is a fan is a true fan.

[indoor fan]

I bought merch. With the little allowance money I was able to save up back in the middle school days I saved up and bought some merch. That seems like something a "true fan" would do, if I do say so myself.

Do you mean to say that a 12 year old who LOVES the Chargers, but lives in Michigan, isn't a true fan of San Diego? Please.

A fan that doesn't have the ability to spend cash can still spread the word. Word of mouth has the potential to bring extra fans to the gate. A fan is a fan is a true fan.

Anyone who LOVES the Chargers after their recent playoff flubs, has got to be a true fan.

[newiflfan]

Anyone who LOVES the Chargers after their recent playoff flubs, has got to be a true fan.


As a Lions fan, I would kill to have my team fail in the playoffs. But that's another topic for another board.

[Bruiser]

I bought merch. With the little allowance money I was able to save up back in the middle school days I saved up and bought some merch. That seems like something a "true fan" would do, if I do say so myself.

Do you mean to say that a 12 year old who LOVES the Chargers, but lives in Michigan, isn't a true fan of San Diego? Please.

A fan that doesn't have the ability to spend cash can still spread the word. Word of mouth has the potential to bring extra fans to the gate. A fan is a fan is a true fan.
You dont count, your parents would have though if they dragged a few of you to the games. You confuse an idle interest in a team to true fanaticism where one spends a fair amount of cold hard cash at the arena. Gimme a break, cannot afford it. Tix are like $5 a pop.

An NFL fan is another thing. Most of them really cannot afford to go to games on a regular basis but there are so many more NFL fans that having them watch on TV does wonders for a team's revenue stream. It's big business, indoor ball definately not so much.

[Caballo Diablo]

As a Lions fan, I would kill to have my team fail in the playoffs. But that's another topic for another board.
I'm a Browns fan and would like someone to explain something to me.

What is this thing you call "Playoff's?"

[newiflfan]

You dont count, your parents would have though if they dragged a few of you to the games. You confuse an idle interest in a team to true fanaticism where one spends a fair amount of cold hard cash at the arena. Gimme a break, cannot afford it. Tix are like $5 a pop.


Hey, thanks for making assumptions about my family and its financial situation while I was growing up. I greatly appreciate it. Very classy of you.

Self-righteous fans drive me nuts, and right now you are acting like one. You'd think, especially in leagues like this, people would just be excited to run across other people who support a team, be it by owning season tickets, or buying t-shirts and learning as much as they can about players. There's no need to try to create a caste system for fans.

[grandmarquis84]

For minor-league sports teams they want their fans to do two things, and in this order:
1. Spend money on tickets or merch: They have to make a profit or the team won't be around very long.

2. Spread the word: Owners want people to know about their team, and it influences other people to fulfill goal number 1.

If I was an owner and you didn't have the means to do 1 but were doing 2, I would be grateful.

[Bruiser]

For minor-league sports teams they want their fans to do two things, and in this order:
1. Spend money on tickets or merch: They have to make a profit or the team won't be around very long.

2. Spread the word: Owners want people to know about their team, and it influences other people to fulfill goal number 1.

If I was an owner and you didn't have the means to do 1 but were doing 2, I would be grateful.
Unfortunately trying to measure #2 is next to impossible. I'd agree with you, but those who say they spread the word usually are just puffing out their chest and dont. They'd rather sit back and enjoy the fruits of real actions by other "true" fans.

[blanketman]

For minor-league sports teams they want their fans to do two things, and in this order:
1. Spend money on tickets or merch: They have to make a profit or the team won't be around very long.

2. Spread the word: Owners want people to know about their team, and it influences other people to fulfill goal number 1.

If I was an owner and you didn't have the means to do 1 but were doing 2, I would be grateful.
I owned an indoor football team for 4 years and its that and so much more. First off ,TT and I were going to buy a team in Buffalo. We put 20k down as a deposit.Wow,that was a joke.The owner of Louisville told me he would sell his entire team for ,get this,125 k including everything. At the time Jk wanted 250k from us.The problem with all of this afl,ifl stuff is that the players are all so close.Duke Pettijohn would have played for us . i flew him up to Rochester with 12 other Afl players.Why would i pay an undersized guy 80k a year.Thats the problem if your not in the Nfl players talent gets Blurred. Are you telling me Duke Pettijohn or any Player in the Afl over the past 5 years was better than a Division three player,and Ifl Sioux city Bandits player that is now the starting running back for the buffalo Bills named fred jackson?.All he did was ran for 200+ yards in his last game and supplant Marshawn Lynch a first rounder from california.......Owners need sponsorships more than anything else.Thats where it gets tough!

[BQJONES]

Blanketman

Duke Pettijohn was superior to any Division 3 player...that's why you flew him up!!!!! You know he was a great player (check his resume)Poltics as usual!!::evil:

[blanketman]

Fred Jackson was from Coe college. He starts for the bills and makes a million a year.A division three guy. What does Duke make a year?

[indoor fan]

Fred Jackson was from Coe college. He starts for the bills and makes a million a year.A division three guy. What does Duke make a year?

You've picked one player. OK..Kurt Warner...he makes 8 million a year.

AFL, AFL 2.0, AF2 were/are all leagues with superior athletes to ANY of the indoor leagues.

[Bruiser]

You've picked one player. OK..Kurt Warner...he makes 8 million a year.

AFL, AFL 2.0, AF2 were/are all leagues with superior athletes to ANY of the indoor leagues.
The debate was about comparing Pettijohn to Div III players not Div 1.
We understand many AFL fanboys are comprehensionally challenged but let's at least try to keep up, OK?

The pseudo-AFL reminds me of this TNA wrestling. You hire all the old washed up has beens (just like the AFL is doing with Harrell, Garcia, et al) and hope it sticks. It may be working for TNA. I understand they are giving McMahon's WWE a run for his money. So much that McMahon is starting to push his old dudes too. Perhaps the marketing of some old Arena superstars will sell a few tickets but you make me chuckle with that "superior" athletes line.

[indoor fan]

The debate was about comparing Pettijohn to Div III players not Div 1.
We understand many AFL fanboys are comprehensionally challenged but let's at least try to keep up, OK?

The pseudo-AFL reminds me of this TNA wrestling. You hire all the old washed up has beens (just like the AFL is doing with Harrell, Garcia, et al) and hope it sticks. It may be working for TNA. I understand they are giving McMahon's WWE a run for his money. So much that McMahon is starting to push his old dudes too. Perhaps the marketing of some old Arena superstars will sell a few tickets but you make me chuckle with that "superior" athletes line.

2008 was only two years ago and is'nt selling tickets kind of important?

[Bruiser]

2008 was only two years ago and is'nt selling tickets kind of important?
Well at least we can agree 2008 was two yrs ago. :roll:

However, the players being described as old have been playing much longer than that. But you knew that already.

Selling tickets is very important. But if you've been reading carefully, according to an actual former team owner, it's not as important as securing sponsorships.

[indoor fan]

Well at least we can agree 2008 was two yrs ago. :roll:

However, the players being described as old have been playing much longer than that. But you knew that already.

Selling tickets is very important. But if you've been reading carefully, according to an actual former team owner, it's not as important as securing sponsorships.

and Sponsors would be more willing to give out money, if there are recognizable names out there (NFL Network, Garcia, Harrell, Stafford, the AFL, etc.)

[Bruiser]

and Sponsors would be more willing to give out money, if there are recognizable names out there (NFL Network, Garcia, Harrell, Stafford, the AFL, etc.)
Hahahahaha. Not a chance. Besides you and me and a dog named Boo, no one recognizes those names.