Am I the only one thinking this...

[grandmarquis84]

What happens if the NFL strikes and the UFL keeps playing? Thoughts...

[Sam Hill]

14 people will watch instead of the 7 who watch now.

I would think college football would be a bigger beneficiary than the UFL would.

The UFL is (and still will be) playing way, way, way off Broadway in 2011.

[mrsummitcitypigskin]

NFL players will not strike. If there is a lockout by the owners,
it'll be in 2012. UFL could be on more solid ground by then and
could perhaps make a dent. They need to be at least an 8 team,
non-NFL market league, by then. They should stick with their fall
schedule, whatever they do. Moving to spring would be disastrous.

[preeths]

Why would the spring be disastrous? How much room is there in the fall?

[Sam Hill]

NFL players will not strike. If there is a lockout by the owners,
it'll be in 2012.

So you've really kept up with the labor negotiations, then?

[mrsummitcitypigskin]

Why would the spring be disastrous? How much room is there in the fall?

I'll answer your question with a question, Mr.Preeths:
How many spring outdoor football leagues have been a success?
Outdoor football is a fall sport. I think America has shown it's lack
of support for the game in the spring months.

And Sam did I miss something? The NFL owners are gonna lock
the players out after the un-capped year. And at these salaries
I'm not sure I'd blame them. I've heard more about lock-out then
strike. If your insinuation points at the calender year, you are right.
Un-capped in 2010, lock-out in 2011. My bad.

[preeths]

I don't think America has shown a lack of support for spring football by any stretch of the imagination. It's really only had one chance to show any support, and the USFL averaged about 25,000 per game and had decent TV ratings that beat ABC's projections. The problem was that salary demands outgrew available revenue. Burgeoning salaries shouldn't be a problem in the UFL because the league controls them. In the fall, they're battling high school, college and pro football, one of which is playing virtually every day of the week and available on television. There just isn't any room.

[ca]

may happen before that uncapped year cause clubs cant pay salaries that their gate returns cant cover . in other words if this doesnt happen dont be overly stunned if some teams go dark football or not as this is an industry woe that moving a club may not solve due to the lack od open markets

[jcompton]

I don't think America has shown a lack of support for spring football by any stretch of the imagination. It's really only had one chance to show any support, and the USFL

Why leave the two-year WLAF out of this tally? True, there were only six US teams, but two or three national broadcasts per week from ABC and USA is a good shot at exposure.

[preeths]

Your point is well-taken, though I was looking at more of a full-blown effort. As you pointed out, WLAF had just half-a-dozen American markets and some small TV markets to boot. Still, I don't think the WLAF should be completely ignored when discussing the potential merits of the spring. The league averaged right around 20-25,000 per game in the U.S. for undisguised minor league football. I would submit again that the spring has shown that it would work better for a secondary league than the fall.

[tops804]

I don't think America has shown a lack of support for spring football by any stretch of the imagination. It's really only had one chance to show any support, and the USFL

XFL? (2001)

Television, really encouraged that league to move forward.
Agree with the Vince McMahon/WWF plan or not. It did show a small
flicker of interest before football fans, or the TV networks wised up.

[preeths]

The main problem with the XFL, tear away all the bluster and hype, was that it was dependent upon primetime ratings at a time when even the venerable Monday Night Football was struggling to stay on network television. Again, as far as attendance and the ability to get multiple TV deals, I think the XFL shows that the spring is a better option than the fall. That league had to average about 25k per game, too. You're right, though, you can't count on primetime ratings on network TV to carry a minor league. That was a flawed business plan from the start, no matter who's doing the marketing. We could also probably throw in Arena Football. Their overspending led them down a dark road, but fans showed an interest in watching it in the spring.

[tops804]

It was actually football-less NBC that was not only the big XFL backer, but
also signed the Sunday deal with the AFL which would probably become
the AFL's downfall through the decade.

NBC actually looked into starting a league with the big-wigs at TNT in the
late 1990's. I'm pretty sure that league wasn't intended to be the
XFL (If anything it helped fuel McMahon's idea). The NBC/TNT league,
I'm pretty sure, fell off the table before it ever hatched past an announcement
and was intended to be a fall league.

[preeths]

Yep, I remember that one. I think I still have some info on it up on the USFL site.

[tops804]

Yep, I remember that one. I think I still have some info on it up on the USFL site.

I found a link on an old website (must've been yours as it has the preeths
extension). I didn't want to post a dead link, but it looks like they were
targeting a fall, 1999 start. NBC's grasp for straws was due to CBS taking
away their rights to AFC games in 1998.

It kind of reminded me of that rival baseball league in the early 1990's.
Here a week, then a faded memory.

[SignGuyDino]

What happens if the NFL strikes and the UFL keeps playing? Thoughts...



To answer the question: EVERYBODY following the UFL knows they are counting on the NFL to have a work stoppage. That's the primary reason to have the league. Of course, they'll claim "real football" with their replicant pastel outfits, and no team in New York proper like they advertised from the start, and when the stoppage ends, the UFL will be completely ignored.


That is, if they get that far. I don't think either the NFL or the union takes this league that seriously as a leverage tool.

[nksports]

Sorry folks. The only ones who win if the NFL has a job action (and if cooler heads prevail, players and owners come together before going over a cliff together) is college football. If the NFL goes dark on Sundays, and it looks like a long stoppage, look for the top teams in mid-major conferences and middle of the pack teams in the BCS conferences switching games to Sundays (with the blessings of CBS, Fox and ABC, CBS College, ESPN, ESPN2 and ESPNU).

[Pounder]

Lesson # 33 in the annals of keeping your league alive: get off NBC. See XFL. See the decline of Notre Dame. See the anger of Olympic fans with NBC (even if the ratings were up this time). See how the NHL has lost some relevance the past few years.

NBC simply sucks.

[mrsummitcitypigskin]

Lesson # 33 in the annals of keeping your league alive: get off NBC. See XFL. See the decline of Notre Dame. See the anger of Olympic fans with NBC (even if the ratings were up this time). See how the NHL has lost some relevance the past few years.

NBC simply sucks.

I agree about NBC. Hell, even the IRL is talking about buying
out their contract with Versus, and negotiating with CBS/USA.
NBC's not even in that mix. That means NBC must be way down
on the pecking order.

[OVWarriorPlayer]

I don't think America has shown a lack of support for spring football by any stretch of the imagination. It's really only had one chance to show any support, and the USFL averaged about 25,000 per game and had decent TV ratings that beat ABC's projections. The problem was that salary demands outgrew available revenue. Burgeoning salaries shouldn't be a problem in the UFL because the league controls them. In the fall, they're battling high school, college and pro football, one of which is playing virtually every day of the week and available on television. There just isn't any room.

I agree whole heartedly

[Sam Hill]

The main problem with the XFL, tear away all the bluster and hype, was that it was dependent upon primetime ratings at a time when even the venerable Monday Night Football was struggling to stay on network television.

That's true.

Plus - and I honestly believe this - McMahon as a polarizing figure helped them at first, but really hurt them when things went south. His bravado was great to get attention early, and there were those who said "Wow, he's done great things with wrestling, if anybody can do this, he can."

And when things went south and he didn't handle them particularly well (plus...he didn't really know how to run an actual football league), he was hoisted on his own petard, by many of the same people.

Again, as far as attendance and the ability to get multiple TV deals, I think the XFL shows that the spring is a better option than the fall. That league had to average about 25k per game, too.

And they did, and they still lost a bajillion dollars. The cost of starting up anything, plus the fact that football is a really expensive sport, took care of that.

There's one theory, though, and it was advanced by the USFL folks as part of the ill-fated move to the fall: That fall is when more people are thinking about and "living" football. Yeah, there's a lot of football to compete with, but they felt that if you were going to do it, at least do it when interest in football was demonstrably the highest.

Of course, the USFL was so screwed up by that point with its infighting that it wasn't healthy by the time it got to that point. We never did get to see what would have happened in the fall of 1986.

You're right, though, you can't count on primetime ratings on network TV to carry a minor league.

Plus, they put games on the absolute worst night of the week to draw the demographic they were seeking.

That was a flawed business plan from the start, no matter who's doing the marketing. We could also probably throw in Arena Football. Their overspending led them down a dark road, but fans showed an interest in watching it in the spring.

That they did. NBC promoted it relentlessly, gave it big-league treatment. The ratings weren't a lot, but their attendance did get a boost. In the end, it didn't help them.

As for the UFL, they should be so lucky as to find out what will happen in the fall of 2011. I feel that when their TV deals run out, if they're still drawing 10-12,000 a game, they're toast.

[mrsummitcitypigskin]

I agree whole heartedly

I gotta stick with my guns Mr. Preeths and OV Warrior.
Spring is no time for outdoor football, unless it's spring
practice for college ball. Spring is Basketball tourney
time, Baseball opening and of course our beloved indoor
game. I respectfully disagree...

[preeths]

I've never believed that March Madness is the insurmountable obstacle some think it is. The NFL, on the other hand, is, especially when you combine it with college and high school ball. And early season baseball? I don't see that as much of an obstacle, either. There just isn't any room left in the fall.

[SignGuyDino]

The very first two days of the NCAA tourney owns the tv. After that weekend though, all but 16 teams are gone. Not that big a factor.