AAPBL.....what a joke!

[SK Fan]

Ball Hogs bounce after unsure welcome in C.R.



Start-up league, city part company before inaugural season tips off


By Mike Hlas The Gazette



Another pro basketball team has left Cedar Rapids. This one never fired a shot.
The Cedar Rapids Ball Hogs
of the first-year All America Professional Basketball League have departed.
‘‘We are not playing any games in Cedar Rapids this season,’’ league founder/president Worth Christie of Casper, Wyo., said Wednesday.
Thus, the Ball Hogs go the way of the Iowa Cornets (Women’s Professional Basketball League, 1978-1980), Cedar Rapids Silver Bullets (Continental Basketball Association, 1988-1991), Cedar Rapids Sharpshooters (Global Basketball Association, 1992) and Cedar Rapids River Raiders (United States Basketball League, 2004).
Christie said he still plans to have 10 teams when the AAPBL’s first season opens Nov. 11. He owns each franchise.
‘‘Perhaps we can start over
in Cedar Rapids in a year,’’ Christie said. ‘‘We had some differences on our agreement with the arena (the U.S. Cellular Center). Second, we ran into a real problem in Cedar Rapids with the attitude that people weren’t going to do any business with us until we’d proven we’d stay there three or four years. We got that virtually everywhere we went.’’
Christie had a signed agreement to hold 31 games at the U.S. Cellular Center this fall and winter but later balked when he saw the amount of the letter of credit the arena was requiring in its final offer.
U.S. Cellular Center Arena executive director Sharon Cummins didn’t name that amount, calling it a negotiating point. She did say the Silver Bullets put up a yearly $30,000 letter of credit for a similar number of dates to protect the arena for reserving so many dates.
Christie and Cummins discussed the terms in the last two weeks. Both said they amicably ended negotiations.
‘‘Things were very different than in the other nine cities,’’ Christie said. ‘‘The requested letter of credit by far exceeded any in any of our other facilities. The rent would have absolutely been the highest in the league and it certainly wasn’t the best building in the league. It’s a good building. I’m not knocking the building. But it wasn’t acceptable for us to tie up funds that we really thought we needed for operating capital.’’
Christie said the ‘‘wait-and-see’’ response in Cedar Rapids differed from most league cities in Colorado, Kansas, Minnesota, Montana and Wyoming.
‘‘People in Cedar Rapids told us to come back to them in a couple years,’’ he said. ‘‘But if you’re not supported right away, you’re not going to stick around.
‘‘We’ve run into the same cynicism in Billings (Mont.) that we ran into in Cedar Rapids, but what we didn’t run into there was the major problem with the arena contract.
‘‘I really hate to make all this stuff public, to get into what sounds like name-calling or whatever. I’m kind of sick to my stomach that I had to walk away from Cedar Rapids. I certainly have a lot of respect for Sharon Cummins and the city of Cedar Rapids. But it wasn’t a business environment we felt comfortable entering at this time.’’
The Ball Hogs opened an office in downtown Cedar Rapids, but it sat empty the last several weeks. They hired a vice president of sales and marketing, Mike Koolbeck, in January. He resigned in February. They announced the hiring of general manager/head coach Bill Klucas on April 12. He quit a week later.
Christie said doubts about the Ball Hogs’ viability ‘‘came from the arena, came from the media, and certainly permeated throughout the business community.’’
‘‘We’ve certainly left the door open for them in the future,’’ Cummins said. ‘‘If they don’t come back, we’d love to have another basketball team.’’
Marion businessman Barry Smith, who founded and owned the River Raiders in their sole season last year, said this week he is considering reviving his United States Basketball League franchise for next year. He said he must be convinced the league would be operated more efficiently than he believes it has been.
The River Raiders averaged a league-high 2,200 fans per game in 2004, but Smith folded it last summer, citing the USBL’s instability and his hesitancy to devote the time needed to make it successful.

[BasketballCoach]

I think that pulling out of Cedar Rapids is smart. If you cant keep a coach/GM for longer than a month then maybe the town isnt ready to embrace you. And if they dont embrace you dont want to be there anyway.

You appear to be a critic and saying 'look, they cant keep a team there'. I look at it as smart that they got the hell out of dodge before they imploded during the season.

And I wouldnt go as far as calling it a joke yet. Though I do like the $1000 fee for the two week summer camp. It used to be that players were invited to camps for nothing and even get reimbursed for the troubles. Now you have any shmuck who thinks they can play, breaking the bank to help bank roll the league office.

Of course it depends on how much beer one has to drink, like me for example. I rationalize a lot more when beer is a lot more in me!

[SK Fan]

I think that pulling out of Cedar Rapids is smart. If you cant keep a coach/GM for longer than a month then maybe the town isnt ready to embrace you. And if they dont embrace you dont want to be there anyway.

You appear to be a critic and saying 'look, they cant keep a team there'. I look at it as smart that they got the hell out of dodge before they imploded during the season.

And I wouldnt go as far as calling it a joke yet. Though I do like the $1000 fee for the two week summer camp. It used to be that players were invited to camps for nothing and even get reimbursed for the troubles. Now you have any shmuck who thinks they can play, breaking the bank to help bank roll the league office.


Of course it depends on how much beer one has to drink, like me for example. I rationalize a lot more when beer is a lot more in me!

I think you are blaming the wrong people. The league hired a local experienced guy who told them what they needed to be doing and the league didn't believe him. He left. The league then hired an experienced coach and he quit after a week. Don't blame the people of Cedar Rapids. We led the USBL in attendance (over 2200 a game) in 2004. I bet most of the CBA and NBDL don't average that! Do you call that "not embracing a team"?

Minor league basketball is not a good investment and it doesn't help when teams play a year and fold. It also doesn't help when a team walks off the court before halftime and leaves.

Also, the AAPBL was unwilling to pay a fee to reserve over 30 dates for the US Cellular Center in CR. Maybe the league was afraid they'd fold before the games were played.

Maybe you should have another beer or twenty, then you might understand the situation in Cedar Rapids. :roll: :shock: :)

[BasketballCoach]

I think you are blaming the wrong people. The league hired a local experienced guy who told them what they needed to be doing and the league didn't believe him. He left. The league then hired an experienced coach and he quit after a week. Don't blame the people of Cedar Rapids. We led the USBL in attendance (over 2200 a game) in 2004. I bet most of the CBA and NBDL don't average that! Do you call that "not embracing a team"?

You missed my point. And it has been noted the CR crowd average was higher than all minor league basketball teams.

I am not blaming either party because I know little about either. My point was if the team didnt show the league or vice versa the respect and trust it needs when developing a league, then drop them before the season rather than during. Note it has nothing to do with the fans! It has to do with, "Will the team succeed at the gate and in the community?"

I said it was a smart move because of that. CR doesnt want another screwball minor league issue it faced with the USBL and starting a season and not finishing it would have executed that point.

Minor league basketball is not a good investment and it doesn't help when teams play a year and fold. It also doesn't help when a team walks off the court before halftime and leaves.

Your mayor who owned the team is the one who folded, albeit a good decision when you look at the USBL movement over the past few seasons. They are trying to keep their heads above water but sooner or later your legs will quit treading.


Also, the AAPBL was unwilling to pay a fee to reserve over 30 dates for the US Cellular Center in CR. Maybe the league was afraid they'd fold before the games were played.

Probably right, but I would look at the leases of each team and each venue before I would make that assumption. If it was par for the course I would guess it would be a non-issue.

Maybe you should have another beer or twenty, then you might understand the situation in Cedar Rapids.

The situation in CR isnt alone and I have dealt with many teams in the same boat and on the same front. Teams fold left and right in minor league basketball and until Mr. Stern truly 'embraces' a minor league system, they will continue to do that, fold and walk out at halftime.

And in closing, is it better to show up and leave at halftime or not show up at all?[/quote]

[SK Fan]

It doesn't look good for a start up league to pull out of a city before the season even starts. The schedule was announced. It is now July and Worth Christie is going to move to another town and start up there?

I guess time will tell whether the AAPBL is successful, but it is not starting off on solid ground.

[minorleagueball]

The team in Pueblo (Pueblo Aztecs) also folded.

[BasketballCoach]

The team in Pueblo (Pueblo Aztecs) also folded.

Pueblo appears to play no home games and would seem to be the leagues travel team. Not sure if this information is correct but please link any news to their folding.

It doesn't look good for a start up league to pull out of a city before the season even starts. The schedule was announced. It is now July and Worth Christie is going to move to another town and start up there?

So to re-iterate my point, is it better to pull out before the season or during? As I stated earlier, its better to pull out before. You know before fans get excited, before sponsors lose money, before players pay ridiculous try-out fees, etc.

I guess time will tell whether the AAPBL is successful, but it is not starting off on solid ground.

I think that this summer league they have coming up will be a true indicator to how things will run. If they get 100 players at $1000 a piece, well you do the math.

[SK Fan]

The team in Pueblo (Pueblo Aztecs) also folded.

Pueblo appears to play no home games and would seem to be the leagues travel team. Not sure if this information is correct but please link any news to their folding.

It doesn't look good for a start up league to pull out of a city before the season even starts. The schedule was announced. It is now July and Worth Christie is going to move to another town and start up there?

So to re-iterate my point, is it better to pull out before the season or during? As I stated earlier, its better to pull out before. You know before fans get excited, before sponsors lose money, before players pay ridiculous try-out fees, etc.

I guess time will tell whether the AAPBL is successful, but it is not starting off on solid ground.

I think that this summer league they have coming up will be a true indicator to how things will run. If they get 100 players at $1000 a piece, well you do the math.

It would be better for a league to have a plan finalized and signed agreements before they went public. Either way, pulling out before the season or pulling out during the season, makes the league look foolish.

And what happens if they don't get 100 players? Is the league using that money to finance the league? Will they then fold the entire league?

[BasketballCoach]

And what happens if they don't get 100 players? Is the league using that money to finance the league? Will they then fold the entire league?

They are at 80 paid so getting 100 could be possible. I dont know if Worth has money bank rolling the league or is hoping this camp will kick start the league.

What I do know is that teams should have an announced venue and management staff in place before any announcements are made. See I agree with you. Without one, you cant have the other.

And in closing, starting a league when you have ownership of all teams would need $3 million to ensure at least three years. If you arent making money after three years, sell. The other side of it is if you dont have $3 million, dont start!

[minorleagueball]

http://www.hispanianews.com/archive/2005/02/10/17.htm

Pueblo Aztecs Basketball - NOT!
You talk about shock...I mean to me. I get this call on Monday morning during my Monday morning Super Bowl quarterback session on the phone with a friend and it’s the league Director of Operations.

He begins to tell me that they picked up the 11th franchise city in the plains division and they decided to suspend the franchise in Pueblo to keep the equal number. He also said that they were concerned with the TV coverage being centered in Colorado Springs and afraid Pueblo might not get the coverage. He also stated that the league cities developed were all in a northern geographical area from Billings, Great Falls, Butte, MT to Mankato, MN. and that presented a travel schedule problem.

The tone of voice was decisive so I knew this decision had been carved in stone.

Joe Cervi of the Chieftain said in an article last week that he wouldn't believe it until he saw it. I emailed him and bet him lunch that it would. I owe you Joe. Mr. Rawlings at the Chieftain told us that the Chieftain would back us 100% I really didn't have any doubt in my mind that Pueblo would have supported the team, because everyone I talked with was really happy to see a professional sports team come to town. The Chamber of Commerce was really helpful with suggestions, the District 60 Athletic Department went out of their way to develop a schedule of days available at the Events center. The Sangre de Cristo Arts Center actually formed a committee to help with the special concerts and events we had planned to offer the season ticket holders.

I truthfully believe that this franchise would have been good for Pueblo, but I guess it's not going to happen. My background for business development fit the position like a glove. I was really into it...excited and looking forward to each day. I apologize to the local business people I talked with about advertising/promotion and season tickets, although no money exchanged hands, and I trust you understand it was a business decision. The City of Pueblo, the residents of Pueblo had nothing to do with the league pulling out.

Maybe one day we will get a professional sports team we can rally around.

Sincerely,

GARY MARTINEZ
General Manager, Pueblo Aztecs

[Tha Man*]

I have stated since the announcement the AAPBL won't work based on its current structure...I am not sad to see them go, maybe the teams need to reinvest in another league, CBA, USBL or IBL..

[SK Fan]

The team in Pueblo (Pueblo Aztecs) also folded.


So now, two teams out of ten have been shut down by the league before even a basketball bounces in the summer league. Doesn't look good for the future of the AAPBL.

[Jeremy]

It is no shock I guess that the BallHogs are gone. I have been waiting ever since the announcement to hear things about the team. There had been nothing, you could see this coming, I could feel it was either just the team or the whole league fading away.

If only the story about the CBA wanting the RiverRaiders was true. Would love to have a real league here. I just hope the RiverRaiders come back, either way, would love the CBA...but guess if I have to deal with the USBL...so be it. Now I really don't know if I would even want this AAPBL back.

[Bill]

Calling the AAPBL a Joke at this point may be a bit strong...

With the Cedar Rapids situation being what it "is"...
It looks like it made sense to walk before the season..
Before is far preferable to during....

The "sell as many franchises as you can and bring in the $$$$" model has put a bad taste in a lot of fans and sponsors mouths.. (SEE ABA)

I would like to say "look at the old IFL" with its primarily single owner model.... The IFL didn't have teams folding at mid season... But then again.. Once Ecklund sold out to the AF2... I think there were a lot of people claiming they were owed money as well...

It's still wait and see for the AAPBL...
Just because they bailed out of Cedar Rapids doesn't make it a joke..
Even if the odds are you'll be correct with that attitude in the end..

[Tha Man*]

I wasn't basing my opinion on the fact they bailed out of CR. My opinion was based on there current structure and attitude of the presenting owner/commissioner (Worth).

[SK Fan]

Calling the AAPBL a Joke at this point may be a bit strong...

With the Cedar Rapids situation being what it "is"...
It looks like it made sense to walk before the season..
Before is far preferable to during....

The "sell as many franchises as you can and bring in the $$$$" model has put a bad taste in a lot of fans and sponsors mouths.. (SEE ABA)

I would like to say "look at the old IFL" with its primarily single owner model.... The IFL didn't have teams folding at mid season... But then again.. Once Ecklund sold out to the AF2... I think there were a lot of people claiming they were owed money as well...

It's still wait and see for the AAPBL...
Just because they bailed out of Cedar Rapids doesn't make it a joke..
Even if the odds are you'll be correct with that attitude in the end..

I would have tied up an arena before announcing a team. And I don't think the US Cellular Center was out of line asking for a $25,000 to $30,000 line of credit for tying up 30 dates.

One other thing........can anyone get on the AAPBL website tonight. I tried and I can't. :roll:

They also bailed out of Pueblo too.

[nksports]

I would be very surprised if this league survives through December.
In Wichita, you have Wichita State on the rebound and strong interest in Kansas and K-State. Plus you have the Thunder hockey team (who gets the prime dates at the Kansas Coliseum). Unless you can survive with 1,000 or less fans a game, you won't have a chance.
Pro basketball in a league that will get mostly D-II, D-III and NAIA players to go with D-I reserves is going to struggle in almost any market.
Then you add in the fact that the franchise is probably going to be paying full price for a 10,000-seat basketball building and will be lucky to draw 2,000.
Wichita's best bet would be to move to a spring league like the USBL (if it survives to next year — about the whole Eastern Division is ready to fold) and play in a smaller building like Newman University's gym (it seats about 2,000 and there aint a bad seat in the house).
Cedar Rapids is in the same boat. You have Iowa and Northern Iowa both within driving distance. You are paying full rent in an arena that is too big for your level of play.
Topeka won't have to compete with ice hockey this year, but KU and K-State are both within driving distance and Washburn gets a good following for a D-II school.
The only towns I see where this thing might survive is the far west teams where you don't have a lot of competition from college teams.