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formerlyknownasfells
03-18-2008, 01:01 PM
3:00 to go in the first half, Rockford leads Dallas 49-44. Dallas was told before the game that they had players who were not eligible for the playoffs, coach threatened to pull their players off the court. It sounds like there is one of those players who is not playing in the game.

Rashii Johnson picked up a technical for kicking a chair.

Thanks to Chuck who is doing the photography for the playoffs for calling me with an update.

LightningMan
03-18-2008, 01:43 PM
Thanks. Keep 'em coming.

formerlyknownasfells
03-18-2008, 02:45 PM
Final from Chicago; Rockford 121 Dallas 108.

Rashii Johnson with 32 for Rockford; Tyrone Rakin had 23 for the Defenders.

formerlyknownasfells
03-18-2008, 03:46 PM
HALF:

Jacksonville 57
Reading 56

formerlyknownasfells
03-18-2008, 04:56 PM
FINAL

Reading 136
Jacksonville 120

tbayz1
03-18-2008, 04:59 PM
Looks like the SLAM competed for a half, but probably ran out of gas with their delpeted roster of 8 guys or so

Thanks for the updates Chris, keep 'em coming!

formerlyknownasfells
03-18-2008, 05:04 PM
No problem. Thank Chuck for calling me at the half and in between games.

The_Whale
03-18-2008, 06:26 PM
anything else?

formerlyknownasfells
03-18-2008, 06:27 PM
I should have something on the Maryland game shortly.

formerlyknownasfells
03-18-2008, 07:39 PM
4:00 to go in the fourth:

Maryland 105
Wilmington 101

formerlyknownasfells
03-18-2008, 07:55 PM
FINAL FROM CHICAGO:

Maryland 125
Wilmington 112

Maryland was down 20 in the first quarter and came back for the victory. No stats yet as Chuck is doing the photography for the games and is running around like crazy.

Maryland/Reading tomorrow for the right to play Rochester on Thursday night in Rochester.

tbayz1
03-18-2008, 08:20 PM
What an upset, congrats to the Nighthawks!

Heres a Thanks to Chuck for the updates, and you gotta post up the pics after this is all said and done!!

LightningMan
03-18-2008, 10:21 PM
What an upset, congrats to the Nighthawks!
I guess by the records you can call this an upset, but this Wilmington team is nothing like the one that gave Rochester one of only two losses this year. Anyway, good luck to Reading and Maryland in the next round.

formerlyknownasfells
03-18-2008, 10:35 PM
FINAL

Arkansas 115
Chicago 102

Arkansas/Rockford tomorrow for the right to play QC on Thursday.

formerlyknownasfells
03-19-2008, 10:36 AM
Predictions for today?

Maryland/Reading I am taking Maryland in an upset. Maryland has been playing very well of late and have this knack for coming from behind to win games. It almost seems as if they have to be down in the first quarter to kick things into gear. Their defense has to stay solid against Tayron Thomas and Stoute and Bailey have to be strong against Jared Mills. Gill can get hot from the outside and so can Omar Weaver. This combo could cause problems for the Railers.

With apologies to Dave Knickerbein (sp?) I see Arkansas taking out Rockford. Arkansas has the athleticism in Jeremy Bell, Gabe Feagin and others. I just don't think the Fury have the legs to beat Arkansas who can run the court well.

formerlyknownasfells
03-19-2008, 01:34 PM
UPDATE FROM CHICAGO:

Possible upset in the making.......

11:20 to go in regulation:

Maryland 72
Reading 71

formerlyknownasfells
03-19-2008, 02:07 PM
FINAL

Reading 104
Maryland 96

LightningMan
03-19-2008, 02:14 PM
Congratulations to the Railers!

DazedAndAmused
03-19-2008, 02:33 PM
I guess by the records you can call this an upset, but this Wilmington team is nothing like the one that gave Rochester one of only two losses this year. Anyway, good luck to Reading and Maryland in the next round.

LM, you're right. The early Wilmington team that started with 5 or 6 straight wins, including one over Rochester, is no where near the same team. That team I believe would have won this league and probably most other minor leagues. But, the loss of three of their starters (various reasons) and other issues made them a sub .500 team (probably sub .300, especially if you take out wins against the "travelers") in the second half. I would have picked Maryland to win the game if I were placing bets....there's always next year. Good news I hear is that the team is doing remarkably well in the community with fan interest. They'll need to do better gametime next year to keep it up I think.

LightningMan
03-19-2008, 02:55 PM
Good news I hear is that the team is doing remarkably well in the community with fan interest. They'll need to do better gametime next year to keep it up I think.
A lot of those 11 wins came at home, and so this crowd is used to a winning team. So yes, the franchise will have to step it back up basketball-wise. But I am hopeful. The thing I really don't know at this level is where you find talent. I mean, 7' reserve center Bruce Brown literally walked in off the street but that doesn't happen every day.

DazedAndAmused
03-19-2008, 04:46 PM
There are several ways to find the talent, regardless of where the home team resides.......the pbl has done a nice job with their combines.....but the player and agent network is pretty strong too. If you have a place where players want to play (like Wilmington believe it or not), they do find you. Of course the paycheck says it all...both the number that appears on it and your likelihood of actually getting it as a player (sad to say.)

I don't know what Wilmington was paying its top players, but if they could secure Ced McGinnis (at least for a while) I have to assume they are competitive. I do assume that there are some local guys...eg, Bruce Brown...that may do other things and may not get paid as much. I think having the local flavor is important.

Now, if you want to use all local players that you don't have to house, that's a bit of a different story. It would be tough to find the talent to be competitive in the PBL.

I do believe Wilmington will come back stronger next year.

tbayz1
03-19-2008, 06:12 PM
Arkansas 112
Rockford 108

So tomorrow for the divisional championships it will be:

Reading @ Rochester
Arkansas @ Quad Cities

These will both be very good games, Reading has beaten Rochester once, and Arkansas has beaten QC once as well. They won't be easy games for the top seeds!

DazedAndAmused
03-19-2008, 08:39 PM
Arkansas 112
Rockford 108

So tomorrow for the divisional championships it will be:

Reading @ Rochester
Arkansas @ Quad Cities

These will both be very good games, Reading has beaten Rochester once, and Arkansas has beaten QC once as well. They won't be easy games for the top seeds!

I wasn't a big fan of the playoff structure in Chicago because I think a few more of the solid market teams could have marketed home playoff games BUT in the end the 4 best teams I believe did get through so it did "work."

tbayz1
03-19-2008, 09:57 PM
I don't hate the idea of having all the games in Chicago, but I don't really like it.

I agree there are teams that could have marketed a playoff game pretty well, and I like the idea of one or two more games in the playoffs for a team, especially if you're a team like Wilmington where they get nice crowds and the fans can really get into it! Maybe they'll change things up next year

runninref
03-20-2008, 08:11 AM
The original PBL playoff plan was to have the tournament in Orlando at Disney. However that would have conflicted with a national AAU tournament that has been scheduled far in advance. The back up plan was Vegas however with the success of the showcase, Chicago was the natural choice. This allowed the league to be smart with its money. It doesn't need to promote itself in non - PBL markets as many teams (including the CBA) will be joining the league next season if all goes as planned.
Propping up two teams to keep the integrity of the league must be expensive. I do offer praise to Tom Doyle and the PBL. This was a great effort for a first season league. When the merger / expansion / takeover / whatever (with the CBA) happens in the off season, I fully expect a very solid minor league.:mrgreen:

psbf
03-20-2008, 08:39 AM
put much stock into a merger, just yet. I've seen nothing official on it. Until I do I'm skeptical.

a1sports
03-20-2008, 09:22 AM
if they dont merge, then I am very skeptical there are any brains running the show in both leagues.

AT this point, as an obervation, PBL must have the money because CBA let a team fold and the PBL didnt. GO WHERE THE MONEY IS !! Because in the back round sits the D-league ready to go EAST and gobble up cities.

DazedAndAmused
03-20-2008, 09:27 AM
psbf, you won't see anything official until long after it is fully done, when there is nothing left to speculate or talk about.....no matter what you call what happens off season, based on what i am told, there in fact will be major shakeups. my best guess is that there will not be a "merger" but that a couple to several cba teams will join the pbl because of the business model. i think (as do alot of people) that the NE ABA teams will fill in the CBA holes and they'll still end up with about 8 to 10 teams next year, with at least half of the teams new to the cba. Both leagues will most certainly end up purging 2 to 3 of their teams from this year.

DazedAndAmused
03-20-2008, 09:41 AM
if they dont merge, then I am very skeptical there are any brains running the show in both leagues.

AT this point, as an obervation, PBL must have the money because CBA let a team fold and the PBL didnt. GO WHERE THE MONEY IS !! Because in the back round sits the D-league ready to go EAST and gobble up cities.

I would agree, except that I am not sure how the difference in season length is rectified. I also think that the CBA needs a merger to happen more than the PBL does, but egos are at play and they may view the mass defection predicted from the NE ABA as a shot in the arm. I believe the PBL is open to it but only if the PBL model is followed.

tops804
03-20-2008, 08:44 PM
I would agree, except that I am not sure how the difference in season length is rectified. I also think that the CBA needs a merger to happen more than the PBL does, but egos are at play and they may view the mass defection predicted from the NE ABA as a shot in the arm. I believe the PBL is open to it but only if the PBL model is followed.

I would have to believe that the league name is a big sticking point.

The CBA feels it has the history.
The PBL has a sense of resolve in these unstable minor league basketball times. (Thank you Joe Newman).

In the end, it will be who jumps to what league. As well as locations of the
last teams left behind. Still, a few left in the Northwest could feel a need to
start a "new league" to save travel costs. If the PBL & CBA merge, I would
hope that the PBL maintains the rights to the CBA name.

DazedAndAmused
03-20-2008, 08:53 PM
hopefully keeping the cba name would be a no brainer. i don't believe that's the hitch. i think the core issues will be about length of season and who actually controls the league. i don't think the pbl guys care if the name changes, but they want a shorter season and control of the league to be able to swiftly reactive when the inevitable issues arise. i'm not sure the cba has/had that capability. they may also not fully agree on which teams stay and go.

bomp
03-21-2008, 12:48 AM
If the leagues don't merge, expect them to be gone in a year or two. The NBA is going forward and they don't need the CBA or PBL. A merger is the only way to save these leagues along with a reasonable business plan. It will happen.

psbf
03-21-2008, 09:07 AM
that a merger may be needed, just not this soon.

DazedAndAmused
03-21-2008, 09:31 AM
that a merger may be needed, just not this soon.


..if anything, it may be too late, although I hope not. bomp is right. there is not a lot of time left to establish an independent minor league that has any significance. clearly the cba and pbl are the only two choices to come together. we'll see.

psbf
03-21-2008, 02:23 PM
I only follow the PBL as a new league, to see how the teams do in average attendence. My main concern is the CBA and the Xplosion. Our hosting the All-Star game would be big news for the team. Obviously, PBL fans could care less about that. But to me this is a big deal. To be honest, a merger concerns me. I can only hope that the CBA has another season.
But even without that event, as long as the Xplosion return(regardless in what league) I'm happy.

DazedAndAmused
03-21-2008, 03:24 PM
personally, i have not witnessed alot of value in hosting an all star event in minor league basketball, but others may have different experiences.

psbf
03-21-2008, 05:31 PM
Hosting an All-Star game is an honor(imo). I don't care what level of a sport it's on, it's a chance for that team to get more exposure both in the city and in the league with visiting fans coming in. The host city always profits both economically and exposure-wise. Unless you have gone thru it, you can't imagine what it's like or the potential. Some would put down a minor league event, but I say any exposure is better than none.

LightningMan
03-21-2008, 06:23 PM
Hosting the MLB All-Star game never seemed to do much for Cleveland as a town.

a1sports
03-21-2008, 07:17 PM
In all my years of sports research, NO ONE wants to host an all-star game at any level unless the league picks up the majority of the tab to have it. No single ownership group wants an all -star game, the costs at any level are too high. In fact, you can even use the same argument for a championship game. I read a great article by the Tampa Bay Bucs NFL owner a few years back, he said the super bowl win cost him tons of money and from a financial stand point it was not worth it. He went into detail of the money it costs to have a championship game and the ceiling that you have in recovering that money and it made sense.

bdaly
03-23-2008, 12:01 PM
While nothing special, here are a few pictures of the Reading v. Rochester semifinal game:

http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=a71frz6.3bz3vd3m&x=0&y=-wjbty0

tbayz1
03-23-2008, 01:03 PM
The link doesn't work

Id like to see some pics of games with more than 1-2k there like the ones on the Sharks website

I plan to go to the championship game, so then I'll get a first hand experience of being at a Sharks game with over 5k there

bdaly
03-23-2008, 02:05 PM
The link seems to be working right now. I did try earlier and it didn't work, then I tried again with success. So, I suspect the site was down briefly. Yeah, I'm surprised they stopped posting pictures right as their crowds got significantly better.

I'm hoping they market the heck out of the championship game. With about a week and a half to market it, it should help them quite a bit.

psbf
03-23-2008, 05:58 PM
off topic, but I'm responding to A1Sports. Why would the owner of the Bucs lose money when he can afford to buy Manchester United(EPL)?! I was elated when the Bucs won it all!!
Alright, back to topic.

tops804
03-23-2008, 08:10 PM
Hosting the MLB All-Star game never seemed to do much for Cleveland as a town.

1981, it didn't -- strike season made it more like a pre-season, all-star, exhibition game.

1997, it did -- for a while. The team went on the decline and so did the
economy. By 2000, it seemed like a whole new atmosphere.

If the PBL holds tournaments like it did in Chicago. I would hope they give other PBL
cities, at least the opportunity, to host the event.

tbayz1
03-23-2008, 08:37 PM
While nothing special, here are a few pictures of the Reading v. Rochester semifinal game:

http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=a71frz6.3bz3vd3m&x=0&y=-wjbty0

Now its working

Good pics bdaly!! Nice crowd too, looks like a much better atmosphere than when I went to the SeaDawgs game with about 1500 there. Thats the Rochester we all know!

Can't wait to be there for the championship game!!

panchess
03-24-2008, 10:31 AM
..and at the minor league level, they can lose cash. The D-League All Star Game is literally a one-game event, and wrapping it around something like the Showcase would be a good idea, as the teams are already there.

Pounder
03-24-2008, 12:46 PM
off topic, but I'm responding to A1Sports. Why would the owner of the Bucs lose money when he can afford to buy Manchester United(EPL)?! I was elated when the Bucs won it all!!
Alright, back to topic.

Learn how rich people become rich.

The worst thing you can do in any business, not to mention sports, is to use your own pockets to fund operations. Buying the team is one thing... but experience shows that NOBODY in the big time, and very few in the minors, use their own money to get players, cover debts, or upgrade facilities.

tbayz1
03-24-2008, 01:00 PM
Yeah, I'm surprised they stopped posting pictures right as their crowds got significantly better.


They finally posted them! I had faith that the Sharks would come through and get caught up with the game photos ;)

Sam Hill
03-24-2008, 03:14 PM
off topic, but I'm responding to A1Sports. Why would the owner of the Bucs lose money when he can afford to buy Manchester United(EPL)?!

Debt.

Banks.

OPM.

Look into it.

Paul S
03-24-2008, 07:55 PM
Buying Manchester United was a lesson in economics.

For ease lets pretend Manchester United cost 1 dollar

He went to a bank and said, I want to buy Manchester United. They cost a dollar. Lend me one dollar. As collateral I will point to Old Trafford (stadium), the good name of Manchester United, the valuation of the players on the open market (soccer players are rarely traded they are sold, Real Madrid came to Man U about Christiano Ronaldo and Man U said they would consider selling him for 80 million Euros), the future tv rights, the future sponsorship rights, the licsense to operate a team in the EPL for a number of years, the tv money (HUGE), radio, internet and value of all future ticket sales which is about 2 dollars.

The bank lent Malcolm Glazier the money, he bought the club and put it into debt. They'll pay it back. They are the richest soccer team in the world and probably the richest sports franchise. Frankly they can simply print their own money.

Pounder
03-25-2008, 11:30 AM
...and expanded their stadium from 68K to 77K and managed to withstand the defection of several fan groups, who started FC United of Manchester.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F.C._United_of_Manchester